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MrsT809
LIF Adult
Member since 9/09 12167 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by JennP
Posted by LittleDiva
Posted by JandJ1224
Posted by LittleDiva
Posted by evrythng4areason
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
I have been researching both sides to this. Just like with anything there is good and bad. I do not think it is the end of the world. Our public education system is broken.
From my understanding, one of the main benefits is that if you are strongly opposed to common core, you could now send you child to a school that does not teach using that approach.
I am interested to see how it plays out. Our education system needs a complete overhaul. We are falling way behind the rest of the world. A little competition might not be a bad thing.
I just question how someone with no experience in the public school system is the answer.
I thought it was interesting I read somewhere that I think Sanders had questioned her, if you weren't in your current financial situation would you be in front of us now for this position... and of course the answer is no.
I don't think she is the "perfect" choice, he could have chosen better. I don't think we need someone with experience in a PUBLIC school system, just experience in education and a better
track record.
Respectfully, I see this so often:
"he/she is not perfect"
"he (Trump) could have made a better choice"
I feel like these phrases are used to gloss over one egregious fault after another.
Could have made a better choice? Um, yeah. Like me. Or you. Or... millions of others more qualified.
The incompetence of one after another of these fools is unprecedented and should concern - at minimum - sensible people.
Uggh, yes I've thought the same thing. To walk into her hearing and not know basic stuff that I was taught literally on day one of Intro to Special Ed or day one of an undergrad course on assessments is horrendous.
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Posted 2/8/17 3:17 PM |
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ElizaRags35
My 2 Girls
Member since 2/09 20494 total posts
Name: Me
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School vouchers
My understanding is that school vouchers will be detrimental to special education.
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Posted 2/8/17 3:42 PM |
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bookworm
Two Little Rosebuds
Member since 8/09 2106 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by PitterPatter11
Posted by lululu
However, a lot of what also goes into the school district is parental involvement. In wealthier communities there are more single income households where one parent can dedicate more time and energy to helping out at the schools.
It's an extremely complicated issue and one that definitely affords those with more wealth to raise children who have a higher success rate as far as going on to four year colleges and advanced degrees. I don't think there is any simple solution and the solution certainly doesn't lie at the federal level or with any voucher system that is mandated nationwide. I am a teacher and I have similar feelings. I have been doing a lot of research on the 30 million word gap that exists by age 3 when you compare children from different economic backgrounds. I am honestly not sure what we can do about this. How can we expose these children to more words, more books, more letters, numbers, shapes, etc. There really needs to be a societial shift. I do not think school vouchers will solve this problem. It needs to start early, much earlier.
Yes. Speaking as a high school teacher who gets pretty great outcomes from kids as per test results, there is a limit to what schools can do. We have saddled schools with the burden of addressing the consequences of child poverty and family dysfunction because dealing with these things in any real way is complex and expensive. When we compare the results of a Success Academy, for example, to those of public schools, we're talking about a charter that engages the family to support home life and insists on a certain level of parental engagement as part of the contract. Pubic schools don't have this latitude: they have to accept whoever shows up on their doorstep.
I bristle at the constant comment that the public school system is "failing." I think New York schools generally offer a strong education through this system, mostly because we pay our teachers a living wage despite all the barking about unions and taxes. In other states, I honestly don't know how you expect to recruit bright, driven, dedicated professionals if you're paying them $30k/year and they can't even afford to own a home. As far as "failing" districts like Hempstead (since it was mentioned) that is often the result of racially and economically segregated populations attending those schools. There's only so much a school can do when children are coming in with such deficits, which only widens when they are neglected, hungry, abused, living in homes where no one reads or helps with homework, etc. The solution to this is to do away with neighborhood districts that allow communities to confine poor children to these homogeneous schools with other poor children, but I'd love to see the Long Island outrage if Syosset moved into a central school district system with, say, Wyandanch and rich kids had to go to school with "those kids." Case in point: the thread that was being batted around on FHF about the parent who realized a family was lying about residency so that the kid could attend the poster's better school.
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Posted 2/8/17 4:11 PM |
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MrsT809
LIF Adult
Member since 9/09 12167 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by ElizaRags35
My understanding is that school vouchers will be detrimental to special education. [/QUOTE
Yeah I don't know how many will benefit from vouchers.
Not to mention all those middle America folks that voted for him. I don't see rural families gaining a whole lot of choice from vouchers either.
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Posted 2/8/17 5:28 PM |
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evrythng4areason
And then there were 4
Member since 1/10 5224 total posts
Name: Kayla
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School vouchers
Would everyone be entitled to vouchers, or just those of a certain income bracket? It appears as if in many places it's only for a certain bracket.
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Posted 2/8/17 8:19 PM |
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PitterPatter11
Baby Boy is Here!
Member since 5/11 7619 total posts
Name: Momma <3
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by bookworm
Yes. Speaking as a high school teacher who gets pretty great outcomes from kids as per test results, there is a limit to what schools can do. We have saddled schools with the burden of addressing the consequences of child poverty and family dysfunction because dealing with these things in any real way is complex and expensive. When we compare the results of a Success Academy, for example, to those of public schools, we're talking about a charter that engages the family to support home life and insists on a certain level of parental engagement as part of the contract. Pubic schools don't have this latitude: they have to accept whoever shows up on their doorstep.
I bristle at the constant comment that the public school system is "failing." I think New York schools generally offer a strong education through this system, mostly because we pay our teachers a living wage despite all the barking about unions and taxes. In other states, I honestly don't know how you expect to recruit bright, driven, dedicated professionals if you're paying them $30k/year and they can't even afford to own a home. As far as "failing" districts like Hempstead (since it was mentioned) that is often the result of racially and economically segregated populations attending those schools. There's only so much a school can do when children are coming in with such deficits, which only widens when they are neglected, hungry, abused, living in homes where no one reads or helps with homework, etc. The solution to this is to do away with neighborhood districts that allow communities to confine poor children to these homogeneous schools with other poor children, but I'd love to see the Long Island outrage if Syosset moved into a central school district system with, say, Wyandanch and rich kids had to go to school with "those kids." Case in point: the thread that was being batted around on FHF about the parent who realized a family was lying about residency so that the kid could attend the poster's better school.
Agree on all points.
I teach upstate in the capital district and I will say that the districts are a lot more economically diverse, which I think has it's benefits.
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Posted 2/9/17 6:57 AM |
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bookworm
Two Little Rosebuds
Member since 8/09 2106 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
To address missing pieces raised by Jenhos on the other thread:
The "problem" with school vouchers (tho defining it as a problem depends in vantage point) is that they drain public schools of funding in a few different ways.
1. The most obvious funding issue is that the formula by which schools receive funding from NYS (I cannot speak to other states) is calculated on a per-student basis. Schools can adjust payroll expenses to account for dropping registration rates, but some costs (like the money to keep buildings open or run bus routes or commitments to loans taken to make capital improvements like new wings and computer labs) are not as flexible.
2. As of now, if you send your kid to private school, the local school district has to foot the bill for transportation to get them there, which can get very expensive. I imagine the same logic would apply for students going to charter schools or opting into public schools in outside districts.
The problem with this is that it is often the most vulnerable kids who are left behind: the ones who couldn't get into a charter school, as many of them have selective admissions requirements, a luxury public schools do not have in the competitive market the voucher system tries to create. They also often come from families in which parents are too timid (as with undocumented immigrant families who try to fly under the radar because they don't trust the system) or too overwhelmed or dysfunctional or absentee to seek a voucher to attend a different school. In sum, it can have the effect of skimming the "cream" from a heterogeneous district and leaving a public school to grapple with a higher ratio of incredibly needy children and a lot less funding to serve them.
I will also say, from the reports from my Florida teacher-friend, it does not go over well in wealthy communities with "A" schools that suddenly poor kids can opt to attend, which goes back to my point about the possibility of Hempstead students suddenly attending Syosset schools. Those schools are "A" because the children are largely coming from stable, financially secure homes and professional, involved parents. My friend's school was downgraded from an "A" to a "B" once this option was opened up in Florida, and the community was livid at the intrusion of these outside kids into their cherished public schools.
I also know with DeVos that she refused to say in her hearing that charter and private schools receiving public funding must be held to the "same accountability measures" as public schools, which is another factor that rigs the game against the public school, which has become the favorite whipping boy. Additionally, I have a serious problem with taxpayer dollars going toward for-profit schools of any kind, which is something DeVos is okay with, though other voucher systems have eschewed this option.
So that was an essay, but maybe now the question has been answered satisfactorily and no one will feel that this is uninformed "whining."
Message edited 2/9/2017 5:48:05 PM.
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Posted 2/9/17 5:21 PM |
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