So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

We're a mess over here! DD is 5 weeks and we've been dealing with her fussing (a lot) during feedings and being incredibly gassy. I attributed it to oversupply/hyperactive let downs. I've been nursing on her one side though since week 2 or 3 (basically when I first realized I had oversupply). The whole time she's had perfect yellow BMs so I felt good knowing she was probably getting enough hindmilk.

Tuesday we went for her one month check-up. She's doing great, growing well. I discussed feeding fussiness with dr (screaming at the breast, refusing the breast after a bit, arching up, etc). She said it sounds like reflux and that I should experiment with my diet. She suggested dairy and nuts elimination(since I was eating a ton of peanut butter). I started with nuts and decided to drop diary as of friday.

As of Wednesday, her poop turned green and mucusy. I spoke to dr who said that's usually indicative of a food intolerance so just see what happens after I change my diet. My first thought was a foremilk/hindmilk imbalance from the oversupply, but they're not bright green and frothy (as typically described). Plus, we've been dealing with oversupply since the early days, why would they suddenly go green? They're darker green and definitely contain mucus. And today, I spotted a tiny bit of blood (will call the dr first thing in the am). So now I'm leaning toward the dairy intolerance/allergy, since I keep reading that green mucusy bowels with blood indicates allergy. I know it takes some time to see a difference, so I'll need to wait it out, but.....

I also called an LC recommended by my hospital. She has a third theory...yeast. DD has had thrush (or so we think) just on her tongue since we got home from the hospital. Nystatin did nothing, diflucan (for her) did nothing. And I took diflucan twice since I started showing symptoms again after taking an antibiotic for mastitis (yeah, did I mention we're a mess?). The ped didn't want to treat DD further and said after a bit, her own developing immune system will take care of it, but the LC thinks the thrush is our main problem. The LC says yeast in the digestive track can cause reflux-like symptoms and bad gas. She even has a theory that links it to oversupply. She wants me to go on a 14 day course of diflucan and DD to be treated again. I'm a little weary of all this diflucan in both our systems, but especially the baby. She also wants me to ask my dr for APNO. She told me to get on a better probiotic than I was on and get DD on one. My ped okay'd the probiotic for her and also said she'd retreat her with diflucan if I wanted to. She also wants me to cut out sugar, white flour, etc. This paired with the dairy/nut elimination means I'm starving!

If you made it this far, I applaud you. So basically I have 3 competing theories...ped says one thing, LC says another, and all I know is my poor DD seems uncomfortable a lot of the time and is pooping green slime--now with blood in it.

I don't know if I just needed to vent or need more input. I'm so frustrated and tempted to stop BFing, but I really want it to work. My mom, who is a pediatric office manager and was a very successful BFer, has actually told me maybe I should stop and if she has milk protein allergy, she should get on neocate formula.

Anyone have similar experiences with thrush or milk protein allergy?

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

consider me your homegirl.

1. oversupply...a miserable blessing.
go braless when ever possible to air those things out. pads will become your best friend...but they are going to keep nipples wet...bringing on thrush. I am now using washable pads. I change bras twice a day.
My #2's thrush lasted forever. one day it disappeared. just keep nipples dry. air out in nothing but a tshirt as often as possible. i know this means leaking...but it is a must.

2. get familiar with mspi. both my babies had perfect poops for 3 weeks...then green, mucus and blood. milk/soy protein intolerance. my kids at 4 weeks broke out bad on their faces. #2 wasn't gaining weight.
no milk, no soy.

3. mastsis...got it twice with #1...never with #2.
#1 used and abused me. on that boob all the time. made my supply nutty. i could not keep up. #2, i took control. i did not need to build a supply...i did not let her hang out on them. i think that helped.

bfing is by far my biggest accomplishment...18 mos with #1. if your baby is mspi...check with insurance first before you throw in the towel. mine did not cover the needed formula.

#2 will be a year next week. i am so over nursing. my nipples have been chafted since august. diflucan...lotions...i am over it. but, she seems to have grown out of intolerence, so success.

fm me 24/7
search mspi for food lists.

you can do this. it seems so crazy now, but it is so new.
good luck hun! and i mean it. no one knows unless they have been there.

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

It sounds to me like an allergy. DS was exactly the same and he had a dairy & soy allergy. A month later he developed an allergy to eggs. A few months after that it was almonds and peanuts. Every time I eat an allergen his stool is exactly as you described, and it always comes back positive for blood. I am currently on an elimination diet (no dairy, soy, eggs, peanuts, tree nuts, and all seafood), which is very limiting but it's gotten much easier. I would eliminate at least the dairy and peanuts for 3 to 4 weeks before trying anything else, but it wouldn't hurt to eliminate soy too right now. A lot of babies with dairy allergies are also allergic to soy, and you can always add it back in to see if your DC is allergic.

Good luck! FM me if you have any questions


ETS: I just read the part about what your mom said. If you really want to continue BFing, it is very do-able. My DS is thriving, and eating like this has become second nature to me. The only time it's really a pain is eating out, but you figure out what restaurants work for you.

Message edited 2/13/2011 8:33:20 PM.

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

Definitely sounds like allergy to me. My son was diagnosed with a milk protein allergy at 6 weeks. He has blood in his stool, was very gassy, arched his back, and had stomach pain. He also had green BMs from time to time, and often had mucousy BMs, especially in those first few months. Our ped said that the mucous was very common in milk allergy babies. I completely eliminated all dairy (obvious and hidden) from my diet the minute we found out, and just started having it again 2 weeks ago when he turned 1 and we started testing him with milk (he outgrew the allergy ). It's very very doable if you want to make it work (which it sounds like you do!). If you have any questions at all, please feel free to FM me!
I also dealt with mastitis when my son was 2 weeks old- NO FUN!!!!! What an awful, terrible thing! Hopefully you won't have to deal with that anymore!

You're doing a great job and can absolutely make it work!! Hang in there and keep up the great work!!

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

Thanks for all the encouragment. And wow Janice, you had all three of my issues. I'm sure I'll be picking your brain more! Based on all your experiences, it does sound like an allergy. So dairy-free it is. It's already feeling tough. I was at MIL's for dinner and bit into a meatball and then remembered that she uses milk to make them, so DH got an extra one. I know I'll get used to it.

Here's a few q's:
Assuming it's dairy, how long after you eliminated it did you see improvement?

How crazy do I need to be? If something says it's manufactured in a plant that also manufactures milk products or tree nuts, do I need to avoid it?

Thanks again!

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

Posted by OrganicMama

Posted by MayBbaby21

Thanks for all the encouragment. And wow Janice, you had all three of my issues. I'm sure I'll be picking your brain more! Based on all your experiences, it does sound like an allergy. So dairy-free it is. It's already feeling tough. I was at MIL's for dinner and bit into a meatball and then remembered that she uses milk to make them, so DH got an extra one. I know I'll get used to it.

Here's a few q's:
Assuming it's dairy, how long after you eliminated it did you see improvement?

How crazy do I need to be? If something says it's manufactured in a plant that also manufactures milk products or tree nuts, do I need to avoid it?

Thanks again!

It does get MUCH easier I've found that Trader Joe's, Stop and Shop and Whole Foods are your best friend. Earth Balance sells a dairy free buttery spread that I love, and Rudi's organic bread is delishious!

For us, it took only a few days until DS stopped with the arching and screaming, but I didn't eat a lot of dairy to begin with. It took almost a month for his stools to test negative for blood.

I wouldn't go too crazy. I don't avoid anything that's manufactured in a facility or shared on equipment with foods that DS is allergic to.

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

My experience with thrush: DS had it & we treated it with oral nystatin. I think it really went away 1 month later as he was growing up. It did not effect eating at all.

Poop changes: DS was having horrendous poops where I thought milk allergy and I went off all dairy. Nothing changed. He was a fussy eater and arches and all that jazz. It was a LOT worse later in the day. I called the covering pediatrician after some spectacularly nasty poops: she said come in the next day...

DS was gaining weight the whole time & making wet diapers. My pediatrician looked at the poop and said it was NORMAL looking. She said that kids go through intestinal maturation... and that most of this stuff is normal IF he continues to gain weight. She said if I wanted to, I could try some special formula... but she didn't think it would make a huge difference and that DS would grow out of it soon. She said she would watch for reflux (but I didn't want DS on too many meds too soon)

He did grow out of it...at about 6-7 weeks old (everything was worst at about 5-6 weeks). I BF for 4 more months before I went back to work.

I know you will probably not listen to my advice... because I wouldn't have at your stage, but lots of poop changes are normal (green, yellow, ect)... and if there is no blood and your kid is thriving, just give him some more time before you put him on tons of meds or change to special formula. I know I got advice on here of milk sensitivity & milk allergy & dairy allergy. It ALL WENT AWAY week 6-7... so my ped's advice was the best for me.

Think about it: if so many kids had a horrible milk allergy to breast milk: what would have happened before fancy formula? We are made to survive & to drink a mother's breast milk is a very animal survival thing to do. I think we over-think things sometimes.

I would lay off the peanut butter though :) That was one of my absolute cannot eat foods (as per my ped). Other things included: broccoli, spinach & onions. Onions really DID effect DS when I had them.

Good luck & I hope things get better for you!

Re: So frustrated-BFing related (oversupply, allergies, thrush, oh my!) LONG

Thanks! I would so love this to be the case for her, but she definitely had blood in her stool, which concerns me. I guess I won't know anything until the dairy is out of my system.

As for the thrush, did you get it from her? I've been treated twice now, but starting to feel symptoms once again.