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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by CaptainCharisma424
and i don't sell anything i download
Ditoo.
then again, i barely DL things anyway, b/c they always mess up my computer  
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Posted 2/6/06 4:26 PM  |
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DebG
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by neeniebean86
Posted by CaptainCharisma424
and i don't sell anything i download
Ditoo.
then again, i barely DL things anyway, b/c they always mess up my computer
the radio used to be a song here or a song there.
Now its entire albums and thousands of them.
I know people who have dl'd over 10,000 songs.
That's excessive and certainly different then a few songs off the radio
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:29 PM |
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Shelly
She's 7!!!
Member since 8/05 14624 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by neeniebean86
I'm not saying that people go it FROM me after i copied it. Just that we DID copy it fro the radio, and how is that different than getting it from someone else?
we also have 100s of cable stations now, so we can copy almost any movie from TV. I dont see how that is so different.
Now, if i were downloading movies and music to SELL, and make a Profit off of, then that's one thing, But, for personal use? completely different, IMO
But I think right there is the difference. In the (sigh) "old days", you would tape something and only distribute it to the people you know. Now, anyone who is linked up to the internet has access to all the files you downloaded.
I just want to add that I have NO SYMPATHY for the recording industry. For YEARS they kept music prices so high for what you were getting and lately- all they put out is crap. I was a total audiofile and spent all my hard earned babysitting money in high school at the local record store. In college, I spent way too much $ on CD's.
When Metallica started suing their fans, I stopped listening to them and realized just how much they sold out. I think tthe best solution is these programs (like limewire, napster, etc...) that you pay a fee too and can download as much as you want.
Not to mention, Have you checked out the price for a concert lately? It's insane. I think since the RI turned its back on their fans with these overpriced concerts, discs that cost a penny to make, etc..., the fans turned their backs on them.
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:32 PM |
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QuoteTheRaven424
22 Months?!!!!
Member since 5/05 13659 total posts
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And If That Isn't A True Blue Miracle
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Re: Hey Deb
i don't know 100 songs, let along 10,000
with me, i'll have a tune in my head, i'll download the song, then i delete it after a few days
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:32 PM |
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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
Name:
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by Shellyesq
But I think right there is the difference. In the (sigh) "old days", you would tape something and only distribute it to the people you know. Now, anyone who is linked up to the internet has access to all the files you downloaded.
I just want to add that I have NO SYMPATHY for the recording industry. For YEARS they kept music prices so high for what you were getting and lately- all they put out is crap. I was a total audiofile and spent all my hard earned babysitting money in high school at the local record store. In college, I spent way too much $ on CD's.
When Metallica started suing their fans, I stopped listening to them and realized just how much they sold out. I think tthe best solution is these programs (like limewire, napster, etc...) that you pay a fee too and can download as much as you want.
Not to mention, Have you checked out the price for a concert lately? It's insane. I think since the RI turned its back on their fans with these overpriced concerts, discs that cost a penny to make, etc..., the fans turned their backs on them.
I completely agree with all you said about the RI (and Metallica). 
but as far as the taping thing- regardless of how excessive its become, the point remains that you can still jsut do the same thing by taping it off of the radio. And whether someone gets the music from the radio, or from me, either way, theyre not giving money to the RA, so what difference does it make?
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:36 PM |
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DebG
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by Shellyesq
Posted by neeniebean86
I'm not saying that people go it FROM me after i copied it. Just that we DID copy it fro the radio, and how is that different than getting it from someone else?
we also have 100s of cable stations now, so we can copy almost any movie from TV. I dont see how that is so different.
Now, if i were downloading movies and music to SELL, and make a Profit off of, then that's one thing, But, for personal use? completely different, IMO
But I think right there is the difference. In the (sigh) "old days", you would tape something and only distribute it to the people you know. Now, anyone who is linked up to the internet has access to all the files you downloaded.
I just want to add that I have NO SYMPATHY for the recording industry. For YEARS they kept music prices so high for what you were getting and lately- all they put out is crap. I was a total audiofile and spent all my hard earned babysitting money in high school at the local record store. In college, I spent way too much $ on CD's.
When Metallica started suing their fans, I stopped listening to them and realized just how much they sold out. I think tthe best solution is these programs (like limewire, napster, etc...) that you pay a fee too and can download as much as you want.
Not to mention, Have you checked out the price for a concert lately? It's insane. I think since the RI turned its back on their fans with these overpriced concerts, discs that cost a penny to make, etc..., the fans turned their backs on them.
There are ALOT Of people who have thier hand in the pot
The artists (who only really make money from concerts these days)
Studio Executives
Label Managers
Runners
Song Writer
Music writer
Recording Studio Mangers
Recording Studio Receptionists
Engineers
Assistant Engineers
Musicians
Markiting Director
Graphic Designer
Album PR manager
Distributer
ect
A lot of people want to point fingers at the band but there is a lot involved
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:36 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by neeniebean86
Posted by Shellyesq
But I think right there is the difference. In the (sigh) "old days", you would tape something and only distribute it to the people you know. Now, anyone who is linked up to the internet has access to all the files you downloaded.
I just want to add that I have NO SYMPATHY for the recording industry. For YEARS they kept music prices so high for what you were getting and lately- all they put out is crap. I was a total audiofile and spent all my hard earned babysitting money in high school at the local record store. In college, I spent way too much $ on CD's.
When Metallica started suing their fans, I stopped listening to them and realized just how much they sold out. I think tthe best solution is these programs (like limewire, napster, etc...) that you pay a fee too and can download as much as you want.
Not to mention, Have you checked out the price for a concert lately? It's insane. I think since the RI turned its back on their fans with these overpriced concerts, discs that cost a penny to make, etc..., the fans turned their backs on them.
I completely agree with all you said about the RI (and Metallica).
but as far as the taping thing- regardless of how excessive its become, the point remains that you can still jsut do the same thing by taping it off of the radio. And whether someone gets the music from the radio, or from me, either way, theyre not giving money to the RA, so what difference does it make?
The difference is on average 1-3 songs per album is released for the radio...now with computers people are not getting 1-3 songs from the radio but rather 9-15 songs from the whole disc.
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:37 PM |
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QuoteTheRaven424
22 Months?!!!!
Member since 5/05 13659 total posts
Name:
And If That Isn't A True Blue Miracle
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Re: Hey Deb
a telltale sign of the impact is the fact that they just shut down 2 movie houses by us
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:39 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by CaptainCharisma424
a telltale sign of the impact is the fact that they just shut down 2 movie houses by us
For our analysis of the current market and the trends we are watching for our graduates it seems as though we can say goodbye to the days of the movie houses and big time studios. As you states two movie houses have closed by you and there are a ton of major (and historical) studios closing down in NYC (its pretty sad actually).
In the next few years say goodbye to the major studios with the major labels and get ready to welcome teh small studio or home studio way of life.
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:46 PM |
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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
Name:
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by CaptainCharisma424
a telltale sign of the impact is the fact that they just shut down 2 movie houses by us
its sad, because it ends up affecting the 'little people'. That, IMHO though, has to do with the Greed, and inequality of the artists & music execs (who will, undoubtably, still make millions each year)... and the common working class individual who will suffer.
Im not saying it clearly, but what i mean is= the more money the industry makes, the more it will go to the already Big Shots. it's nto going to get "Average Music Receptionist Joan" a higher salary or a position higher up on the corporate ladder.
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:46 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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The cure IS worse!
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by neeniebean86
Im not saying it clearly, but what i mean is= the more money the industry makes, the more it will go to the already Big Shots. it's nto going to get "Average Music Receptionist Joan" a higher salary or a position higher up on the corporate ladder.
Thats for sure, most of our grads need to work a minimum of 6 months free internships before a studio will even think of hiring them for a runner or receptionist position at a whooping $5.5 or $6 per hour.
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:48 PM |
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Shelly
She's 7!!!
Member since 8/05 14624 total posts
Name:
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Re: Hey Deb
I think the movie theaters are shutting down for a different reason. I don't think as many people download movies as they do music. I also think the bootleg DVD's are not such major competition.
What IS the major competition to the studios are the DVD's and cable distrubutions of the movies (which are perfectly legal and the studios are getting compensated their asking price). Especially now that DVD's have so many better features (deleted scenes, alternate endings, etc...) than goign to the movies. Also, the prices of the movies and the never ending commercials and previews have alienated a lot of people who used to go to the movies. Anyone who has every had to hire a babysitter knows they are paying an extra 30 minutes for previews and commercials.
I also have to add, I have noticed movies are now shown at awkward times. I wanted to see a movie with a friend last night in Queens at around 8:00 and nothing was showing! Only 7:30 and 10:00. 
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:56 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
ignore
Message edited 2/6/2006 4:57:21 PM.
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| Posted 2/6/06 4:57 PM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Hey Deb
I dont know if this will come out how I mean it...BUT my opinion is that half of these people impacted make too much money to begin with for what they do...Now Im talking Exec's and Artists....and If they stopped making a million dollars for everything, then theres no way the smaller people would EVER lose their job because the flow of money would be more equal.
I think if they started selling music and concerts and movie tickets etc at a reasonable price then there wouldnt be a problem of stealing at all. Not on the level we are talking about anyone. Not even close.
Because I know I would MUCH rather go to the movie theater to see a movie, but Free versus $10 for a ticket for one person is a BIG difference if you like movies and see them often.
And Then I see a Star being paid 10 million dollars for a movie...Did they REALLY work that hard, $10 million dollars worth of hard? Of course not.
So pay them what normal people get paid, lower the ticket prices, everyone keeps their jobs and fairness might actually be obtainable.
but thats never going to happen, so I guess I feel that if your gonna take a job in the entertainment industry and its on the lower end of the pay scale or the first job to get cut when people start wising up and figuring out ways to get it for free...well your buying into the ripping off of America by helping make Movies and concerts etc Multi Million dollar events where the money is not spent wisely at all.
I do see both sides of the story, but there ARE two sides of it...
Sorry, stepping off MY soapbox now...just another prespective to add....
Message edited 2/6/2006 7:51:20 PM.
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| Posted 2/6/06 7:49 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
Donna- You work insurance which I also see as a bazillion trillion dollar industry. Filled with corporation and richass exec's. The same could happen in your world in a blink of an eye.
I think its easy to tell someone to get in a different field, but not that easy to actually do.
Message edited 2/6/2006 7:57:31 PM.
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| Posted 2/6/06 7:54 PM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by DebG
Donna- You work insurance which I also see as a bazillion trillion dollar industry. Filled with coroption and richass exec's. The same could happen in your world in a blink of an eye.
I think its easy to tell someone to get in a different field, but not that easy to actually do.
No, Im not telling one to go to a different field, Im saying that they have to know that they are perpetuating the problem, and deal with it.
When I joined my current company we were a NOT FOR PROFIT company, so no none of that even applied.
We were bought out and now are for profit, and yes it actually does change the way I view the company, in a big way.
But I justify "some" of it...as you pay $400 a month for health insurance, if you go to the Dr's like I have this year, my insurance company has paid out triple on what it got for me...so its not always a bad thing....but I cannot see how its justified in paying a "star" millions...
Does any of it mean I wouldnt go and work at a million dollar job if offered to me in the movie industry, of course not, Im human..I would do it in the blink of an eye, because and only because I dont think it would ever change, not now, its too late for the industry, but I would know that the industry was unfair and I would understand someone "stealing " here and there some songs on a computer. I really would.
And people on an insurance level steal all the time. Dr's and patients change codes to get things paid they shouldnt, things they didnt pay for, does it bother me...no not at all. If you need something and need to lie or steal to get it when it comes down to health, go ahead. If I lost my job because of it, How could I be mad?
I know this is not coming out how I truly mean it to, so bare with me....I just think there really is two sides to the story...
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:03 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
There are two sides of the story. However, I am a STRONG proponent of one side.
It stealing and its copyright infringement. Thats what it boils down to me. PLain and simple. Poeple trying to justify that its ok because the other side is making million of dollars is just trying to soften the blow and make them feel more justified in thier actions.
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:09 PM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by DebG
There are two sides of the story. However, I am a STRONG proponent of one side.
It stealing and its copyright infringement. Thats what it boils down to me. PLain and simple. Poeple trying to justify that its ok because the other side is making million of dollars is just trying to soften the blow and make them feel more justified in thier actions.
I really do see the copyright part, and I do understand. I pay for my music downloads though, so for me Im not justfying anything, because I see it another way but I dont do anything illegal.
So how do you think things will change ? And you dont agree that if the "stars" were paid less , the problem would be "slightly " illeviated? Cause thats just my opinion, it could be wrong.
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:15 PM |
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DebG
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Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
I tink that the RIAA has already instilled a ton of changes. Yes prices were once getting out of hand and a CD was going for 19.99-24.99 now if you go into a store you will see more and more CD's priced at about 14 bucks.
LOL. This debate always makes me think of a quote from the American President:
"Let's see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil; who's standing center stage, advocating at the top of his lungs that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours."
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:17 PM |
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Redhead
You Live, You Learn
Member since 5/05 31871 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Hey Deb
interesting thread....
but i relly don't think we can really use the excuse of the high costs of movies and theater tickets...
prices for everything, EVERYTHING is going up. If you want to do it/have it...you are going to have to pay for it. Stealing isn't the answer. Now we know the mentality of people stealing anything....
this coming from the person who bought her first bootleg a week or so ago..
Ultimately it was wrong...I was wrong
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:23 PM |
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DebG
Pick a cause & stand up for it
Member since 5/05 18602 total posts
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Re: Hey Deb
This may seem funny...but I have a lot more respect for the person who does it, knows its wrong and it admits its wrong rather thena the person who does it, won't admit its wrong and tries to justify the crap out of it.
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:25 PM |
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QuoteTheRaven424
22 Months?!!!!
Member since 5/05 13659 total posts
Name:
And If That Isn't A True Blue Miracle
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by DebG
This may seem funny...but I have a lot more respect for the person who does it, knows its wrong and it admits its wrong rather thena the person who does it, won't admit its wrong and tries to justify the crap out of it.
thanks babe, you're a pal  
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| Posted 2/6/06 8:57 PM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by DebG
This may seem funny...but I have a lot more respect for the person who does it, knows its wrong and it admits its wrong rather thena the person who does it, won't admit its wrong and tries to justify the crap out of it.
I hope this wasnt implied to me...because I dont justify anything. I dont steal point blank but there is never ever one side to any story and I hope I brought another side to it. And I didnt see anyone on this thread say they didnt think it was wrong?
to be honest I DO not think anyone should ever steal music or buy bootlegs, I dont, BUT the bottom line is how do you stop these people from doing it. Isisnt that the goal? I was expressing my opinion on how it could changed, what would maybe bring the change.
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| Posted 2/6/06 9:06 PM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by Redhead
interesting thread....
but i relly don't think we can really use the excuse of the high costs of movies and theater tickets...
prices for everything, EVERYTHING is going up. If you want to do it/have it...you are going to have to pay for it. Stealing isn't the answer. Now we know the mentality of people stealing anything....
this coming from the person who bought her first bootleg a week or so ago..
Ultimately it was wrong...I was wrong
I think your looking at it the wrong way. I didnt justify stealing because of the high prices???? I said lowering the price would in a cause and effect manner lower the amount of stealing. There really cant be a debate about it. Its clear. And lowering salaries to the "stars" makes the people who dont get paid millions and lose their jobs when stealign occurs, NOT feel the impact as much if they are more equal.
My views have nothing to do with stealing being right or wrong. I think its wrong, but I think people need to come up with solutions that are real and obtainable to stop it.
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| Posted 2/6/06 9:12 PM |
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Redhead
You Live, You Learn
Member since 5/05 31871 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Hey Deb
Posted by dm24angel
Posted by Redhead
interesting thread....
but i relly don't think we can really use the excuse of the high costs of movies and theater tickets...
prices for everything, EVERYTHING is going up. If you want to do it/have it...you are going to have to pay for it. Stealing isn't the answer. Now we know the mentality of people stealing anything....
this coming from the person who bought her first bootleg a week or so ago..
Ultimately it was wrong...I was wrong
I think your looking at it the wrong way. I didnt justify stealing because of the high prices???? I said lowering the price would in a cause and effect manner lower the amount of stealing. There really cant be a debate about it. Its clear. And lowering salaries to the "stars" makes the people who dont get paid millions and lose their jobs when stealign occurs, NOT feel the impact as much if they are more equal.
My views have nothing to do with stealing being right or wrong. I think its wrong, but I think people need to come up with solutions that are real and obtainable to stop it.
wasn't talking about you or what you said specifically...
I have heard this excuse used by MANY people actually....
How many people do you know really get demotions, other than due to poor work performance or consolodations?
People, most people will continue to rise up that pay scale not go down. So saying that we should pay them less, well it ain't going to happen. So i don't bother thinking aboutit that way.
Like i said, everything is going up. The prices of EVERYTHING. Doesn't mean we should steal it to have it...And that is actually what some people do and how they justify it
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| Posted 2/6/06 9:18 PM |
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