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LuckyStar
LIF Adult
Member since 7/14 7274 total posts
Name:
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My fellow working moms
I've been saying from the beginning that this pandemic is going to damage the careers of mothers and that damage will take years, if not decades to reverse.
I know many of you feel the same.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/02/04/parenting/working-moms-coronavirus.html?campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20210204&instance_id=26794&nl=the-morning®i_id=61883863&segment_id=51053&te=1&user_id=f654f67588b007eac983997fa213d48b
(sorry, I can't get it to hyperlink, but worth the copy and paste).
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Posted 2/4/21 2:22 PM  |
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Long Island Weddings
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seaside
LIF Adult
Member since 6/08 3101 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by LuckyStar
I've been saying from the beginning that this pandemic is going to damage the careers of mothers and that damage will take years, if not decades to reverse.
I know many of you feel the same.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/02/04/parenting/working-moms-coronavirus.html?campaign_id=9&emc=edit_nn_20210204&instance_id=26794&nl=the-morning®i_id=61883863&segment_id=51053&te=1&user_id=f654f67588b007eac983997fa213d48b
(sorry, I can't get it to hyperlink, but worth the copy and paste).
I saw this this morning. I think that's why a board like this one is so invaluable at a time like this. Community and support is everything right now. This is hard.
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| Posted 2/4/21 2:24 PM |
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lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9511 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
I think that this pandemic has really illustrated the inequities that exist in the home between men and women. There was a clip on the Today show a few weeks ago about a book that was just written that shows the damage being done to our children by having them witness mothers bear the brunt of the household work. Boys develop expectations that their wives will perform most household duties which eventually will lead to resentment from their future wives. Girls end up limiting their expectations of their career potential because they feel that they will have to shoulder most of the household work. It's a lose lose all around as far as women's equality. I wish I had written down the name of the book.
As for me, I just try to take it day by day. I let things go like if my house is a complete disaster I just don't care anymore. I think my kids will benefit from me not being on edge all the time than having a cleaner, more organized house. They have also been eating way more take out than they should, oh well.
Somethings gotta give...
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| Posted 2/4/21 2:42 PM |
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NervousNell
Just another chapter in life..
Member since 11/09 54921 total posts
Name:
..being a mommy and being a wife!
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by lululu
I think that this pandemic has really illustrated the inequities that exist in the home between men and women. There was a clip on the Today show a few weeks ago about a book that was just written that shows the damage being done to our children by having them witness mothers bear the brunt of the household work. Boys develop expectations that their wives will perform most household duties which eventually will lead to resentment from their future wives. Girls end up limiting their expectations of their career potential because they feel that they will have to shoulder most of the household work. It's a lose lose all around as far as women's equality. I wish I had written down the name of the book.
As for me, I just try to take it day by day. I let things go like if my house is a complete disaster I just don't care anymore. I think my kids will benefit from me not being on edge all the time than having a cleaner, more organized house. They have also been eating way more take out than they should, oh well.
Somethings gotta give...
We have kind of reverse gender roles in our home. My DH Has been a stay at home dad since DD was 18 months old.
He also does all the cooking (due to his dietary needs but regardless he cooks every night). He also does all the grocery shopping. I can't even recall the last time I did a full grocery shop.
He's also WAY more of a clean freak than I am. I couldn't give a crap if the house is a mess- he will clean, wash dishes, etc because he can't stand it.
I have always worked outside the home, travelled for business etc.
It kind of just worked out this way because he retired young and we had DD late in life but I am very glad that my daughter is able to grow up seeing non traditional gender roles.
Right now DD is in school full time, so the only difference is I'm working from home instead of an office.
But yeah in the spring when we were forced into that god awful distance learning, it was a struggle. DH does help DD with her homework often, but I feel like the whole online school thing fell more on me because I was very anal about it- getting the assignments, making sure things were done on time, sitting with her etc
Message edited 2/4/2021 7:00:02 PM.
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| Posted 2/4/21 2:46 PM |
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ali120206
2 Boys
Member since 7/06 17792 total posts
Name:
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My fellow working moms
My DH is helpful at home - he cooks most of our dinner, does the dishes and he vacuums but he doesn't bare the brunt of the online learning, picking things up, laundry, or driving my (sorry, I just got interrupted by my 3rd grader) 11 year old to baseball or basketball practice. He also works out of the home 48 hours a week in 2-24 hour shifts so it's stressful to me that when he's home, he's not taking on more as I am working full time and doing everything else (don't get me wrong, I hate vacuuming and cooking lol but I feel it's uneven).
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| Posted 2/4/21 2:50 PM |
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Momma2015
Mommax2
Member since 12/12 6656 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
"And it just feels like failing, every day, at everything I do. And I just want to change, want to be by myself for one minute. I don’t know how to keep doing this. But there isn’t really another option.”
I feel this, so so much. I have a DD in virtual Pre-K and my DS is almost 2 and home full time. We got a puppy for Christmas (seemed like a good idea at the time!) so I'm potty training the dog and my DS who suddenly decided he wanted to use the potty and working full time and I barely have time to remember to log into DD's class let alone do the stupid assignments with her. I generally don't even do them, I do my own thing with her. It's Pre-K. I don't really feel like she's falling behind. I almost want to just pull her from it entirely to take at least ONE thing off my plate. Then cooking and cleaning and visiting my mom who is 5 minutes from our house (my father died in August, so she needs all the support she can get. It just never stops. I never have enough time or energy or patience. I just had to hold my half naked toddler on my lap during a video call with my supervisor while he screamed hi repeatedly.  Luckily, she has a 4 and an 8 year old who are both home so she is understanding. THANK GOD!
ETA: My DH is useless. He comes home from work and immediately takes a 1/2 hour sh!t, strips off his jeans, sweatshirt, dirty socks and sneakers and leaves them on the floor, plays video games and occasionally "entertains" the kids by handing them his iPad with a show on it. Then usually decides he's going to go shower around the time I start cooking dinner. Eats, throws his plates in the sink and back to video games maybe with a beer thrown in while I bathe the kids and put them both to bed one after the other. And then tells me I'm crazy when I finally lose my shit.
Like CookiePuss said, I can't be task master, too. And even when I do- I asked him to please make sure he took out both the full recycling and garbage this morning, he took out the recycling, left the full, smelly garbage.  He can't even get it right when I straight up tell him what to do. And I don't want to be his boss, because if I tell him go get the HUGE heavy bag of salt out of the garage before I break my neck on the stairs (yes, days after it snowed, still no salt) he responds with "Yes miss, right away miss." like he's so f@cking put upon because I'm an awful nag of a wife.  I don't even know what to do anymore.
Message edited 2/4/2021 3:24:02 PM.
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| Posted 2/4/21 2:57 PM |
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CookiePuss
Cake from Outer Space!
Member since 5/05 14021 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
I am kind of a weird place. My DH has been working from home since March 2020 while I was required to still go to the office 100% of the time.
Previously, I had worked a little less...one half day during the normal work week and I carried a lot, if not most, of the "typical" household duties. I shopped, I managed everyone's schedule and made sure they got where they needed to go and medical needs were met, I cleaned, I cooked, etc. Now my husband is home and I am still doing it all.
It's been an ongoing fight. He tells me to just ask but I can't be all of it including the task master. The kids have chores but I still have to enforce them. They call me to find out what to eat.
It's not fair and I am losing all of me.
But, there is light as we are slowly moving towards his shouldering more of the burden.
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| Posted 2/4/21 3:07 PM |
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LuckyStar
LIF Adult
Member since 7/14 7274 total posts
Name:
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My fellow working moms
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
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| Posted 2/4/21 4:03 PM |
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Lucky09
2017!
Member since 1/06 7537 total posts
Name:
DW
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
This. DH and I split some of the household stuff, but I am more the "manager/planner" of food shopping / menus, household chores, kids schedules etc and it wears on me.
I work with a lot of men, and their lives don't seem impacted / changed one bit whereas all of the women I know are hanging on by a thread. There was a meme somewhere that said during the pandemic men lost weight because they were forced to eat home cooked meals, worked out more because they worked from home more, had time to excel at their careers, take a course for career development etc. Then it showed a picture of a haggard woman cooking/cleaning, managing schooling for their kids, typing on their laptop for work...
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| Posted 2/4/21 4:17 PM |
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lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9511 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
But that is specifically where this start as in the book I mentioned above. It's because our children develop certain perceptions of expectations based on how they see their parents behave. I would say your household with a 50/50 split is probably not the norm. In most households, even where the men and women work the same amount of hours, the woman still bears the brunt of the household responsibilities.
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| Posted 2/4/21 4:30 PM |
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PitterPatter11
Baby Boy is Here!
Member since 5/11 7619 total posts
Name:
Momma <3
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by CookiePuss
I am kind of a weird place. My DH has been working from home since March 2020 while I was required to still go to the office 100% of the time.
Previously, I had worked a little less...one half day during the normal work week and I carried a lot, if not most, of the "typical" household duties. I shopped, I managed everyone's schedule and made sure they got where they needed to go and medical needs were met, I cleaned, I cooked, etc. Now my husband is home and I am still doing it all.
It's been an ongoing fight. He tells me to just ask but I can't be all of it including the task master. The kids have chores but I still have to enforce them. They call me to find out what to eat.
It's not fair and I am losing all of me.
But, there is light as we are slowly moving towards his shouldering more of the burden.
We are living the same life. I have been back at in-person work since September and my DH is still working from home.
My DH tells me I need to ask him to help. How about you see the dishwasher is full and you turn the thing on?!?!?! No one needs to tell me when I put in the last plate in that it is full. I use my eyes and realize, hey, it's full, I should turn it on.
My DH will do anything I ask him to do, but here's the thing, I do not want to have to ask. I want him to use his eyes like I do and then complete tasks without being asked. I am not asking for him to realize when the bathroom needs cleaning or the floors need vacuuming - just basic things that you can literally see.
Don't even get me started on cooking. I plan out and cook all meals (lunch and dinner EVERY SINGLE DAY). We very rarely get take-out. At least once a month on a Friday, I ask him what he wants for dinner and he says, "I don't know." I go insane. Pick something. He has now learned that on Fridays if I ask that he better come up with a meal and either make it or get takeout.
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| Posted 2/4/21 4:42 PM |
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FirstMate
My lil cowboy
Member since 10/10 7790 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
Yes!!! 10000% yes!!!
I can not express enough gratitude for my (male) boss who gives me the leeway and freedom I need to deal with my situation. He has 4 kids but a SAHM wife but he still feels a lot of compassion for me. BUT it pisses me off that it's always ME making the adjustments to my schedule and jockeying all of the stuff around. DH trots off to work every morning at 6 am, hot coffee in hand, before anyone wakes up and goes to work in his office. I'm not saying his job isn't stressful but he is not dealing with kids in the morning. He can NOT work from home so any Covid related disruptions fall on me.
DH is an awesome partner. We are definitely 50/50 with the physical stuff but the mental stuff? Meaning the overall management of "stuff" is 100% me.
I finally went to the salon this week after not having gone since June. I was really looking forward to my "me" time. I had a very late appointment. At 8:30, DH texts me to let me know our child care for the next day had to cancel due to exposure. Thanks for ruining my zen! Did he sweat it out? Hell no. I came home to him sleeping soundly. I on the other hand scrambled a bit and then said "f" it, I'll work from home tomorrow. It sucks!!!
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| Posted 2/4/21 4:49 PM |
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NervousNell
Just another chapter in life..
Member since 11/09 54921 total posts
Name:
..being a mommy and being a wife!
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
Message edited 2/4/2021 4:50:56 PM.
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| Posted 2/4/21 4:49 PM |
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HeyJude
LIF Adolescent
Member since 9/07 820 total posts
Name:
p
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Message edited 2/21/2021 7:59:10 AM.
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| Posted 2/4/21 5:09 PM |
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ali120206
2 Boys
Member since 7/06 17792 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
That is good.
In my last position - there were many women with families in high profile roles but they had full time help to manage their households so they seldomly had to leave early to "catch that train" to be home at a certain time.
Now thankfully most of the higher ups in my group are on the same page and my job is more local so it's even easier during normal times to balance work and life.
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| Posted 2/4/21 5:09 PM |
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Momma2015
Mommax2
Member since 12/12 6656 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
You're very lucky!
I switched positions in November, so my new supervisor is a mom and is far more understanding, especially in the middle of a pandemic. My last supervisor, a woman, had no kids and was VERY hard on myself and my co-worker who had kids. After I had my DS, she said you're done, right? This is the last time?
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| Posted 2/4/21 5:23 PM |
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LuckyStar
LIF Adult
Member since 7/14 7274 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by lululu
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
But that is specifically where this start as in the book I mentioned above. It's because our children develop certain perceptions of expectations based on how they see their parents behave. I would say your household with a 50/50 split is probably not the norm. In most households, even where the men and women work the same amount of hours, the woman still bears the brunt of the household responsibilities.
Yes, of course those perceptions start in the home. And as long as we perpetuate these ideas as being normal, the longer we will hold girls back. The longer there will be pay inequality. But that's a different topic for a different day.
While I agree that the mom is more often that not responsible for more of the household duties than dads, I would argue that instances where women in dual income families handle 100% of the household duties are rarer than you think. There was a huge boom in working moms in the 80's and now the children of those women are now having children of their own. Even on this thread, most have said their husbands handle some to half of household responsibilities. So, on a whole, I would say we are moving in the right direction. We still have a long, long way to go as a society, though. I certainly agree there.
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| Posted 2/4/21 5:50 PM |
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LuckyStar
LIF Adult
Member since 7/14 7274 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
That is awesome and you are very lucky!
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| Posted 2/4/21 5:54 PM |
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nycbuslady
LIF Adult
Member since 9/15 1066 total posts
Name:
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My fellow working moms
I didn't read the article, but I agree that women tend to take on more of the "mental load" of running a household. And, I agree with a PP that things are changing. I hate cooking, and my husband is really good at it, so he cooks and does the grocery shopping. I do the cleaning. But, he will start the dishwasher or put in a load of laundry, etc. So, I actually am fine with our division of labor.
The funny thing is my parents. They're 79 and 81 and have been retired for a while. My father does all the laundry and washes dishes. He also takes care of all the outside stuff. My mother cooks, shops, and cleans the house. So, people DO evolve! LOL!
Also, as an FYI, to make something a hyperlink, you highlight it and then press Control-K. (My daughter taught me that!) Of course, that works on a computer; I don't know how to do it on a phone.
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| Posted 2/4/21 6:23 PM |
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CookiePuss
Cake from Outer Space!
Member since 5/05 14021 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by LuckyStar
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
That is awesome and you are very lucky!
You are extremely lucky and should be the norm...not the exception.
i work in a very small office and some of the things that have been said to..would blow your mind. As a woman, I am held to a much higher standard. My male counterpark and I can make the same mistake...I get ripped a new a$$hole while it's "no big" deal.
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| Posted 2/4/21 7:12 PM |
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CookiePuss
Cake from Outer Space!
Member since 5/05 14021 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by PitterPatter11
Posted by CookiePuss
I am kind of a weird place. My DH has been working from home since March 2020 while I was required to still go to the office 100% of the time.
Previously, I had worked a little less...one half day during the normal work week and I carried a lot, if not most, of the "typical" household duties. I shopped, I managed everyone's schedule and made sure they got where they needed to go and medical needs were met, I cleaned, I cooked, etc. Now my husband is home and I am still doing it all.
It's been an ongoing fight. He tells me to just ask but I can't be all of it including the task master. The kids have chores but I still have to enforce them. They call me to find out what to eat.
It's not fair and I am losing all of me.
But, there is light as we are slowly moving towards his shouldering more of the burden.
We are living the same life. I have been back at in-person work since September and my DH is still working from home.
My DH tells me I need to ask him to help. How about you see the dishwasher is full and you turn the thing on?!?!?! No one needs to tell me when I put in the last plate in that it is full. I use my eyes and realize, hey, it's full, I should turn it on.
My DH will do anything I ask him to do, but here's the thing, I do not want to have to ask. I want him to use his eyes like I do and then complete tasks without being asked. I am not asking for him to realize when the bathroom needs cleaning or the floors need vacuuming - just basic things that you can literally see.
Don't even get me started on cooking. I plan out and cook all meals (lunch and dinner EVERY SINGLE DAY). We very rarely get take-out. At least once a month on a Friday, I ask him what he wants for dinner and he says, "I don't know." I go insane. Pick something. He has now learned that on Fridays if I ask that he better come up with a meal and either make it or get takeout.
I think I am going to get a meal delivery service for him. Twice a week...either he or the kids can cook it. Comes will all the ingredients and instructions. Should be idiot proof.
As you say, I can't be the one to ask you to do things. That, in an of itself, is exhausting. make a list!
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| Posted 2/4/21 7:17 PM |
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NervousNell
Just another chapter in life..
Member since 11/09 54921 total posts
Name:
..being a mommy and being a wife!
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by CookiePuss
Posted by LuckyStar
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
That is awesome and you are very lucky!
You are extremely lucky and should be the norm...not the exception.
i work in a very small office and some of the things that have been said to..would blow your mind. As a woman, I am held to a much higher standard. My male counterpark and I can make the same mistake...I get ripped a new a$$hole while it's "no big" deal.
I tihnk it also comes down to small companies vs big. I have worked for small companies and in general they were always more toxic.
Large companies, especially publically traded ones, with a legal and big HR dept generally are more progressive and fair- or at least they try to be.
I also find that my company has females in high level positions- executives and C level. The CFO is a woman and it's rumored she may be the next CEO when the current one retires. The VP of HR is a female. I feel like that makes a difference.
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| Posted 2/4/21 7:26 PM |
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queensgal
Smile
Member since 4/09 3287 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by PitterPatter11
Posted by CookiePuss
I am kind of a weird place. My DH has been working from home since March 2020 while I was required to still go to the office 100% of the time.
Previously, I had worked a little less...one half day during the normal work week and I carried a lot, if not most, of the "typical" household duties. I shopped, I managed everyone's schedule and made sure they got where they needed to go and medical needs were met, I cleaned, I cooked, etc. Now my husband is home and I am still doing it all.
It's been an ongoing fight. He tells me to just ask but I can't be all of it including the task master. The kids have chores but I still have to enforce them. They call me to find out what to eat.
It's not fair and I am losing all of me.
But, there is light as we are slowly moving towards his shouldering more of the burden.
We are living the same life. I have been back at in-person work since September and my DH is still working from home.
My DH tells me I need to ask him to help. How about you see the dishwasher is full and you turn the thing on?!?!?! No one needs to tell me when I put in the last plate in that it is full. I use my eyes and realize, hey, it's full, I should turn it on.
My DH will do anything I ask him to do, but here's the thing, I do not want to have to ask. I want him to use his eyes like I do and then complete tasks without being asked. I am not asking for him to realize when the bathroom needs cleaning or the floors need vacuuming - just basic things that you can literally see.
Don't even get me started on cooking. I plan out and cook all meals (lunch and dinner EVERY SINGLE DAY). We very rarely get take-out. At least once a month on a Friday, I ask him what he wants for dinner and he says, "I don't know." I go insane. Pick something. He has now learned that on Fridays if I ask that he better come up with a meal and either make it or get takeout.
I totally relate to this. And it’s maddening. They want us to be the CEO and bear the entire mental load so they do simple tasks while feeling like a hero.
I’ve started holding my husband accountable for meal planning. All I ask is a 5 min convo on weekend to make a shopping list. His look of disgust when I first started making him do it. “I don’t want to think about it now”. Ummmm neither do I but as a woman, for some reason I don’t get that luxury.
He is hands on with childcare but I do all financial decisions/planning, house repair and maintenance etc. it’s a lot. He helps with cleaning but he’s not very detail oriented - he’ll load the dishwasher but not wipe down counters or stove, etc.
No one else mentioned laundry. He gets mad when I ask him to carry the heavy basket up.....but I carried it down, washed it and will put it away.
Somehow the women’s liberation movement got this all wrong. Men took advantage of our desire for freedom of choice to just get away with being man-boys. Makes me sad, I promise to raise my son differently.
Message edited 2/4/2021 7:45:31 PM.
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| Posted 2/4/21 7:42 PM |
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FirstMate
My lil cowboy
Member since 10/10 7790 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by queensgal
Posted by PitterPatter11
Posted by CookiePuss
I am kind of a weird place. My DH has been working from home since March 2020 while I was required to still go to the office 100% of the time.
Previously, I had worked a little less...one half day during the normal work week and I carried a lot, if not most, of the "typical" household duties. I shopped, I managed everyone's schedule and made sure they got where they needed to go and medical needs were met, I cleaned, I cooked, etc. Now my husband is home and I am still doing it all.
It's been an ongoing fight. He tells me to just ask but I can't be all of it including the task master. The kids have chores but I still have to enforce them. They call me to find out what to eat.
It's not fair and I am losing all of me.
But, there is light as we are slowly moving towards his shouldering more of the burden.
We are living the same life. I have been back at in-person work since September and my DH is still working from home.
My DH tells me I need to ask him to help. How about you see the dishwasher is full and you turn the thing on?!?!?! No one needs to tell me when I put in the last plate in that it is full. I use my eyes and realize, hey, it's full, I should turn it on.
My DH will do anything I ask him to do, but here's the thing, I do not want to have to ask. I want him to use his eyes like I do and then complete tasks without being asked. I am not asking for him to realize when the bathroom needs cleaning or the floors need vacuuming - just basic things that you can literally see.
Don't even get me started on cooking. I plan out and cook all meals (lunch and dinner EVERY SINGLE DAY). We very rarely get take-out. At least once a month on a Friday, I ask him what he wants for dinner and he says, "I don't know." I go insane. Pick something. He has now learned that on Fridays if I ask that he better come up with a meal and either make it or get takeout.
I totally relate to this. And it’s maddening. They want us to be the CEO and bear the entire mental load so they do simple tasks while feeling like a hero.
I’ve started holding my husband accountable for meal planning. All I ask is a 5 min convo on weekend to make a shopping list. His look of disgust when I first started making him do it. “I don’t want to think about it now”. Ummmm neither do I but as a woman, for some reason I don’t get that luxury.
He is hands on with childcare but I do all financial decisions/planning, house repair and maintenance etc. it’s a lot. He helps with cleaning but he’s not very detail oriented - he’ll load the dishwasher but not wipe down counters or stove, etc.
No one else mentioned laundry. He gets mad when I ask him to carry the heavy basket up.....but I carried it down, washed it and will put it away.
Somehow the women’s liberation movement got this all wrong. Men took advantage of our desire for freedom of choice to just get away with being man-boys. Makes me sad, I promise to raise my son differently.
MEAL PLANNING The bane of my existence!!!! Actually all of it...planning, shopping, putting groceries away and then freaking cooking it all!
DH said to me this past weekend "Don't you get sick of looking for recipes and making lists?" Umm...how do you think all your meals get here, pal? Do you think the chicken and vegetables just magically show up in the fridge and the recipe comes to me like an effing epiphany in the middle of the night and I throw it all together?????
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| Posted 2/4/21 8:30 PM |
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MK2010x2
LIF Infant
Member since 8/17 142 total posts
Name:
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Re: My fellow working moms
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by CookiePuss
Posted by LuckyStar
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by LuckyStar
My DH and I split household duties as close to 50/50 as possible. But the fact of the matter, and it's mentioned in the NYT piece, is that the father who leaves a zoom meeting early to pick up his kid is lauded as a "good dad" but the mom who leaves early is irresponsible and not on her A game.
That, IMO, is a much harder inequality to address than the burden of cooking and cleaning falling to the mom in any given household. It's a societal issue first.
I guess it depends though on your employer. I work for a very large Tech company and never once in my 10 years of employment here - from the day I started 7 months pregnant- to now- has anyone made me feel irresponsible for having to leave a Webex call early, have to come in late because my daughter had a dr appt, or had to leave early to go see her in a school production etc.
They really do pride themselves here on empowering women, having a good work/life balance, making sure employees feel that it's ok to have to go do something for your family as long as you are a responsible employee and don't' abuse it.
In fact, my boss spoke to me yesterday and asked if I would be interested in a new initiative they have to train and promote women to move into director roles because they feel their is a disparity in how many males are directors in the company vs. female directors.
So I have to say I'm pretty lucky. And I am hearing from more and more of my friends who work in the industry that their companies (the larger ones) are moving towards this as well.
It may be the exception to the rule now, but hopefully things are finally starting to change in that sense.
Because you are right. It's straight up, antiquated BS that people still think that way in 2021
That is awesome and you are very lucky!
You are extremely lucky and should be the norm...not the exception.
i work in a very small office and some of the things that have been said to..would blow your mind. As a woman, I am held to a much higher standard. My male counterpark and I can make the same mistake...I get ripped a new a$$hole while it's "no big" deal.
I tihnk it also comes down to small companies vs big. I have worked for small companies and in general they were always more toxic.
Large companies, especially publically traded ones, with a legal and big HR dept generally are more progressive and fair- or at least they try to be.
I also find that my company has females in high level positions- executives and C level. The CFO is a woman and it's rumored she may be the next CEO when the current one retires. The VP of HR is a female. I feel like that makes a difference.
Your posts are very interesting and a lot to consider. I think you are on to something with the large/small companies.
One other thought I had - in your first post you mention that you have a sort of role reversal with your husband and that he handles a lot (you travel, he works from home, etc.) I wonder if that makes a difference in the way you are perceived at work.
I personally work for a big company and totally agree with you that with HR and policies, it is a more understanding environment. I have also turned down promotions because I feel I have to make a choice between a better job and my kids. I know if I take that step up I will be working longer hours, there will be higher expectations and either my job or my kids will have to take a hit.
My husband thinks he is fairly helpful - will do housework and try to help with childcare. Overall though, he is not responsible, he is "helping". He does VERY little of the mental load, almost no cooking and also has the "you have to tell me what to do and I'll do it" that some of the others mentioned.
He is just never the one who is ultimately responsible.
My daughter asked my husband to be the mystery reader in her class. I thought this was fantastic (and surprising). It was so disappointing to find out that of the 20+ kids in the class, he was the only dad on the sign up list.
I really appreciate this thread and hearing the experiences of others.
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| Posted 2/4/21 9:09 PM |
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| Pages: [1] 2 |
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