What do you think of this situation....

One of my best friends wrote this to the french mastiff assocation.. I have enclosed both the letter to them and the response ...



I have a French mastiff that will be 2 soon I have had him since 8 weeks old he has always been very territorial in my home and yard...they call it the alfa problem I guess we have been dealing...but he is getting more difficult instead of easier this past week I have taken my 14 year old for stitches in his eyebrow clear through the muscle and last night my other son 17 while arguing with his father was bitten in the elbow and it looks like Jaws got him ...In my way of thinking a dog should never attack for any reason the homeowners or guests inside the home we should be safe from our pets and they should keep us safe from what lurks outside..something is wrong with our dog....can someone help us I do not want there to be a next time !!! And I don't want to put our dog to sleep...we lost our first French mastiff Zeus to cancer at 2 years old ....please help us....

Response

Hi Kim,
In all honesty, there should not be a "next time". This boy needs to be put to sleep. I know it's not what you want to hear, but ANY dog that bites a human, especially a dog over 50 pounds does not be alive to put humans in danger (and that's what this boy is doing, next time may cost a human their life and in addition, cost you everything you own). I hate telling people that, but please, look at the bigger picture, not just how you feel now, but how you would feel if he really injured/killed a child? Also look at the future of the breed and think about "breed specific legislation", would you want your dog to be the cause of the breed being banned in your city/state, therefore ending the lives of all the ddb in your area/state? Also be aware that if you attempt to rehome him or place him with a rescue and his bite history comes out, that you and your family would still be responsible/liable for his actions.......

And I will say that no, this is NOT the correct temperament for the breed, there is something wrong with him, mentally... Have you spoken to his breeder and are they aware of temperament issues? This breed should NEVER be aggressive towards humans UNLESS there is a real threat, then they should "neutralize" the threat (meaning knocking down, holding down, not really "biting")...

Believe me when I say it's the hardest thing you will ever do, I know, I have had to do it several times and it's never easy...... I mourn the ones lost still to this day, but I did what what right by the breed, the general public AND the dog...... I am very, very sorry your family is going through this and that you lost your previous boy to cancer..... It's just not fair.......... If I can help in any way, please feel free to contact me.

Kris & the Brats
www.ddbsarescue.org

Message edited 1/11/2012 3:29:51 PM.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

WOW! I can't believe they aren't giving your friend any alternative options at all. I'm shocked and I honestly disagree. There are "last chance" rescues that rehabilitate dogs.

I know a lot of people on the board are anti-Cesar Milan but I would probably try to contact him or his rehabilitation center.

Also, maybe this isn't the right environment for this dog. We loved our old dog, Ursa, but she was not the dog for US. She was a chow/german shepherd mix and she bit both my brother and sister on the face. They were THIS CLOSE to losing an eye each. But she was a great, loving dog with me, my mom, and my dad, but that was it. She just wasn't good with kids, even older kids (since my siblings were 10-13 at the time). We found a rescue for dogs like her that would rehabilitate her and rehome her. I believe the place has relocated, but I contacted my mom to see if she has the info. My mom works a lot with dog rescues in NY and she was shocked at that letter, too. She's looking into it though.

Sorry your friend is going through this, I remember how heart breaking it was for our family to give Ursa up, I can't imagine being told to put him to sleep!

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Posted by jilliibabii

WOW! I can't believe they aren't giving your friend any alternative options at all. I'm shocked and I honestly disagree. There are "last chance" rescues that rehabilitate dogs.

I know a lot of people on the board are anti-Cesar Milan but I would probably try to contact him or his rehabilitation center.

Also, maybe this isn't the right environment for this dog. We loved our old dog, Ursa, but she was not the dog for US. She was a chow/german shepherd mix and she bit both my brother and sister on the face. They were THIS CLOSE to losing an eye each. But she was a great, loving dog with me, my mom, and my dad, but that was it. She just wasn't good with kids, even older kids (since my siblings were 10-13 at the time). We found a rescue for dogs like her that would rehabilitate her and rehome her. I believe the place has relocated, but I contacted my mom to see if she has the info. My mom works a lot with dog rescues in NY and she was shocked at that letter, too. She's looking into it though.

Sorry your friend is going through this, I remember how heart breaking it was for our family to give Ursa up, I can't imagine being told to put him to sleep!

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Wow. I am shocked. I cannot believe that response and I DON"T AGREE WITH IT AT ALL.

I hope your friend finds another option. Sounds to be that the rescue just doesnt want to be bothered taking the dog. Bottom line, thats what I hear.

I wish Ceasar did house calls.

Message edited 1/12/2012 7:13:42 AM.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

I would find a trainer that deals with aggressive dogs and see if they could help her. Hopefully she will exhaust all options before letting go of her beloved pet :(

We used this daycare center and they are affiliated with this trainer. I would call and see if she could give your friend some advice or refer her to a trainer near her area.

http://www.whoswalkingwhodogtraining.com/class_private.shtml

Wishing your friend the best of luck

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Wow...that sounds really extreme to me...

It sounds like the person is more concerned with maintaining the way the breed is viewed for business/show purposes, as opposed to actually helping the dog...

Message edited 1/11/2012 4:19:20 PM.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

My old vet does training. Maybe she could contact him and he could help. Here's his website:

The Balanced Canine

Re: What do you think of this situation....

I really feel for your friend and it's a horrible situation but a dog that size that has bitten people on several occasions and who your friend says "is getting worse, not better" is a huge liability. I'm putting myself in the shoes of the next door neighbor, or the kid down the street god forbid that this dog escapes...and we all know that this happens.

Do I believe that dogs can be rehabilitated? Yes. However, even Cesar Milan takes "red zone" cases to his rehabilitation center, sometimes for several weeks. Cesar Milan is not an option for most dog owners, unfortunately.

If I were your friend, I would reach out to other places including rehabilitation centers, trainers, and heck, even try cesar milan. However, if she really works to keep this dog and he continues to get worse, I would not let him be in the same house with my children

furthermore, if this dog does ever maim or kill a person, your friend will lose everything ESPECIALLY if evidence comes up that she didn't take the advice of this "expert."

Re: What do you think of this situation....

My uncle is a trainer and has 2 French mastiffs and 1 English mastiff. He has had mastiffs for over 20 years. If you would like I can FM you his info.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

I feel very bad for your friend. While I agree that putting the dog down should have been an option, I dont think it should have been the ONLY option. Yes, some dogs can be rehabilitated. Unfortunately it usually takes a lot of hard work and a lot of training to get there. Another thing to consider is the size of the dog. We're not talking a little nippy terrier (I grew up with a biting pekinese and always had to hide my toes). We are talking a very large dog that can (has) done serious damage. Your friend absolutely has an obligation to protect her family.

That being said, your friend should at least been offered some organizations that might be able to rehabilitate the dog. She should have been given the names of some trainers that could step in and help. I think it is very sad that your friend is dealing with this after loosing her other doggie to cancer

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Re: What do you think of this situation....

for your friend.

This makes me so sad, and there is no easy answer. I think the first thing she HAS to do is isolate the dog. The dog simply cannot be around her children, or anybody other than its primary caretaker at this point. The risk is just too great. I have no idea about rehabilitating dogs, or whether that is something she can even afford (I imagine it costs a lot.) Can she isolate the dog so that she can care for it but so that her children and nobody else will be around the dog so that the risk of a bite is eliminated for now? I know it's not a long term solution, but perhaps that will buy her some time to look into the options the other ladies have posted about.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Okay! So my mom e-mailed a bunch of her rescue friends for advice and she forwarded this e-mail back to me from one of them. I hope this helps.

I beg to differ with the opinion offered below. I think that the email put your daughter's friend on notice of all of the possible dangers of keeping the dog without training (and of surrendering the dog to a rescue where there is no chance for him). But if she loves this dog and isn't willing to give up on him, she should definitely have a behavioralist/trainer assess/evaluate him and then make a decision based on that (which is the advice that she asked for in the first place). Without knowing the details, were the teenagers teasing the dog, roughhousing with him, was the dog sick, etc., I feel that there is no way ANYONE should ever offer up advice as extreme as that.

Tyril Firth is in Brooklyn and I can highly recommend him. He probably does work out of the NYC region and can be reached at 800-434-2050. www.tyrilfrithcanineacademy.com . He comes highly recommended and I know he has worked with really tough cases.
If he can't do it, maybe he can recommend someone. She can feel free to use my name (randi lass).

I had an aggressive Akita for 11 years from the time she was a puppy until the time of her natural death. I went through great lengths to keep her. Expensive training,never walking her without a muzzle, never allowing her off leash, not allowing strangers to enter my apartment, etc. But that was my decision and it kept others safe and it kept her alive. I am not suggesting that everyone can make these lifestyle choices (it wouldn't be something that I could do at this point in my life) but I loved that dog and she was kind and gentle with my "inner circle".

Don't allow this woman to pin the fate of the breed on your daughter's friend. She is giving her opinion without ever meeting the dog the same way you are getting advice from this woman without knowing her credentials and experience (is she a behavioralist? has she had a terrible experience with a mastiff?). A true assessment would allow this dog-owner to make an educated and informed decision, one that should be able to override an emotional one.

Wishing her the best of luck.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Thank you to all of you for caring so much.. Jilliibabii I forwarded this to them along with another posters uncles name So hopefully they will try to handle this before putting the dog down,,

They seem to be asking me for all of this info on trainer so I believe they are goinfg this route!! Thank God.. And thank you to all of you >>>>>

Re: What do you think of this situation....

No problem!!! If my mom gets any other rec's, I'll FM you!

Re: What do you think of this situation....

I'm never in favor of putting dogs down. That being said I think the is just so much training a dog can do. We forget that they have natural instincts that we will never be able to fully understand. Did they get this dog from a reputable breeder? If this dog com from aggressive parents then this will likely be a problem forever. Biting to the point where your children are going to the hospital is not biting, it's attacking. I love my dog mor than anything but I would never put my child's life in jeopardy. Your friend should definitely avoid arguing, yelling, horse playing around the dog.

Message edited 1/13/2012 11:42:42 PM.

Re: What do you think of this situation....

Message edited 1/14/2012 6:17:00 AM.