For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

Do you think that one day they will realize what has been done to them or is the programming so deep that it cannot be un-done ??? I know that age of the SC probably plays a large factor...

In my SD's case: Bio-mom had always been very subtle and round-about w/ the PAS in her younger years ( not telling DH of special events until either the last minute, or after they happened, not letiing him know when she got hurt (hospital visits and all) until the day after so that he wouldnt be there, not giving him forms for school pictures yet sending them out to his family members just to be spiteful, down-playing anything fun DH did with her (basically blowing her off when she was excited and told bio-mom), telling her when she was 3yo. that it hurt her feelings when I polished her nails (even though I was with DH since she was an infant - DH and bio-mom were never married), basically only telling him things when she needed $...I could go on and on but it would be a book ...Anyway, SD is a very sensitive child , always wanting to please everyone which makes this situation even sadder..Anyway, when my DS was born, my SD was over the moon about being a big sister and adored him- I guess bio-mom felt insecure about this, almost as if she was getting something from us that she couldnt give her (tubes tied) and took PAS to the next level- she even had a blow-up in court and told the judge that my DH loved my DS more than his DD !!!!...Obviously this irked the judge, and didnt make her look very sane, but when she didnt get the CS raise she was looking for, that was the beginning of the end.....The last time SD came w/ us for vists happily was when we all went on a cruise together (the 4 of us), her bio-mom told her to make sure she called her from the port and my poor SD called her from our 1 day in port all day and mom never answered (my SD started to panic I think, that we werent going to bring her home, telling is we were dialing the wrong #, even when we let her dial by herself etc...) The mom said to my DH when he picked her up for the cruise"You're going to bring my baby back right ???" Who says that in front of an 8 year old, very sensitive little girl ???...Anyway, long story short, my SD never stayed over again and its now at the point that she won't even come for visitation (even though she was for 8 years)...My DH now tries his best to maintain contact via letters mainly as my SD gets so upset when he calls because of god knows what the bio-mom told her (prob that he is calling to pick her up)...She's now almost 11 and it breaks our hearts- she now has another sibling on the way and its so sad that she won't get a chance to know him/her if something doesnt change...Ther poor thing leads such a sheltered life because bio-mom has severed her relationship with SD's grandma, grandpa and all but one aunt on the bio-moms side (she is very hard to get along with, so none of her own familly speaks with her)...Meanwhile my DH has a very loving LARGE family who misses her, and my family as well ..And to know my DH, he is the most sensitive caring gentle man I know and never wants to make waves (just like SD)

Anyway, sorry for the long winded tale here, does anyone think she will come around one day and see what is happening ? I try to remember what it was like to be 8 years old and what I can re-call from that age and its not much, and I am worried for DH and SD that all she will know is what she is told daily by the bio-mom and forget just how much love they had (she writes I love you etc... in the cards she sends back, but does she mean it ???)...I guess its really getting to me even more than normally because the new sister/brother will be her in 4 months and I want her to have a place in their life and vise versa and it hit home all over again

Message edited 8/25/2008 1:59:25 PM.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

Hi, i'm new to the boards and this is actually my first post so i'm confused by some of the lingo (i.e. PAS). From what I got, your situation is so typical. I have 2 SK's...1 SS (14yo) and 1SD (13yo) both from DH's first marriage. It's scary how similar your story sounds to the hell we've lived for the past 8 years. I just wanted to say that you're not the only one and we've been dealing with this for years. Our case isn't as extreme in some ways since both SK's still come to visit, however, the mind games and emotional trauma they are being put through are very similar. My advice is to just stay patient and never stop reaching out to this little girl. I've come to realize that kids will just shut themselves out. This is so sad.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

I 1st want to give you tons of Please know you are, unfortunately, not alone.

I think it is a bit more difficult in your case because she has been brainwashed since such a young age. You mentioned that she brought you guys to court for a child support increase. Does DH still pay child support? He should use the court to enforce his visitation. Your DH sounds a bit like mione with the not wanting to make waves, but it would actually be best for SD. She will never get to know you guys or even have the opportunity to figure things out for herself if she cant spend any time with you all.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

That's awful!

I agree with PP that you should talk to DH to see if he will be willing to use the courts to enforce visitation. Or even just threaten the mom with "no visits = no child support". In NY, if your child refuses to see you and you are not permitted to be a part of his/her life, you do not have to pay child support. That rule is to prevent situations just as this. My DH is like yours. We had a situation similar to that but he refused to stop child support.

I wish you lots of luck with that. It can be so unnecessarily difficult.

BTW, what is PAS?

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

I'm sorry you have to deal with this. It sounds like plain old jealousy on the Biological Mom's part. That's why she has to make you and your DH look like the bad people. I too, go through a lot of this with my SD's mother. Her life is a mess, and she's so jealous of the life my DH and I have that she has to talk negatively about us to SD every chance she gets. She's so jealous, that when I was pregnant with our DS, she went and got pregnant (while single)!! My SD is 10, and she's just starting to be able to sort the facts from the lies when it comes to BM and her talking about DH and I. She'll come around as she gets older and see who the better parents are. You just need to be patient and wait for SD to mature a bit and realize what her BM is doing.

Message edited 8/25/2008 12:35:29 PM.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

Posted by 1stimemom

I 1st want to give you tons of Please know you are, unfortunately, not alone.

I think it is a bit more difficult in your case because she has been brainwashed since such a young age. You mentioned that she brought you guys to court for a child support increase. Does DH still pay child support? He should use the court to enforce his visitation. Your DH sounds a bit like mione with the not wanting to make waves, but it would actually be best for SD. She will never get to know you guys or even have the opportunity to figure things out for herself if she cant spend any time with you all.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

Posted by legallyblonde

That's awful!

I agree with PP that you should talk to DH to see if he will be willing to use the courts to enforce visitation. Or even just threaten the mom with "no visits = no child support". In NY, if your child refuses to see you and you are not permitted to be a part of his/her life, you do not have to pay child support. That rule is to prevent situations just as this. My DH is like yours. We had a situation similar to that but he refused to stop child support.

I wish you lots of luck with that. It can be so unnecessarily difficult.

BTW, what is PAS?

Message edited 8/25/2008 1:55:02 PM.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

Posted by AnaMaree77

Hi, i'm new to the boards and this is actually my first post so i'm confused by some of the lingo (i.e. PAS). From what I got, your situation is so typical. I have 2 SK's...1 SS (14yo) and 1SD (13yo) both from DH's first marriage. It's scary how similar your story sounds to the hell we've lived for the past 8 years. I just wanted to say that you're not the only one and we've been dealing with this for years. Our case isn't as extreme in some ways since both SK's still come to visit, however, the mind games and emotional trauma they are being put through are very similar. My advice is to just stay patient and never stop reaching out to this little girl. I've come to realize that kids will just shut themselves out. This is so sad.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

I battled with this question in the early years of my marriage and being a child of divorce myself this is what I've concluded.
Nobody really wants to think badly of their own parent, it hurts.
Even people that have parents that are criminals still love them KWIM?
So my theory is that the scales will become more balanced as our SKs w/PAS become adults. They will start to see the good their bio-fathers have done for them & the type of person they really are. And while they'll still love their Bio-mom's and may not want to talk about those bad things or be reminded of them they'll realize they happened & hopefully be better parents/spouses/people because of it.



being a step-mom is the hardest thing I've ever done.

Re: For those w/ SC's that suffer from PAS....

Posted by KellyFG

I battled with this question in the early years of my marriage and being a child of divorce myself this is what I've concluded.
Nobody really wants to think badly of their own parent, it hurts.
Even people that have parents that are criminals still love them KWIM?
So my theory is that the scales will become more balanced as our SKs w/PAS become adults. They will start to see the good their bio-fathers have done for them & the type of person they really are. And while they'll still love their Bio-mom's and may not want to talk about those bad things or be reminded of them they'll realize they happened & hopefully be better parents/spouses/people because of it.




being a step-mom is the hardest thing I've ever done.