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MrsA714
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by annoyedTTCer
I'm sure plenty of bad people grew up going to church/still attend.
Going to church doesn't make you a good person.
Just like going to jail doesn't necessarily rehabilitate you. Obviously people are just trying to come up with other options here (maybe not all that well thought out but...).
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Posted 9/27/11 11:19 AM  |
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gina409
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g
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Just bc I am curious and I am not that keen on our legal system what kind of crimes committed would make one eligible for this
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| Posted 9/27/11 11:21 AM |
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GoldenRod
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Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
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Shawn
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by gina409
Just bc I am curious and I am not that keen on our legal system what kind of crimes committed would make one eligible for this
It says misdemeanor crimes in the article, so from Wikipedia, I found this short list, to give a general idea:
Depending on the jurisdiction, examples of misdemeanors may include: petty theft, prostitution, public intoxication, simple assault, disorderly conduct, trespass, vandalism, drug possession, reckless driving, and other similar crimes.
That particular town will have variations on the list of course, but it gives a rough idea of what crimes would be eligible.
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| Posted 9/27/11 11:24 AM |
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DiamondGirl
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Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
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DiamondMama
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
I don't think this is a terrible idea.
My only opposition is it seems like this is geared toward just the Christian faith and to me THAT is unfair. It should encompass all faiths.
Meeting with the pastor is recieving counseling--but FREE--as opposed to programs where non violent offenders are are required to meet with social workers/PO officers for a period of time. THAT costs money, meeting with clergy does not so in that respect it is good for the tax payer.
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| Posted 9/27/11 11:58 AM |
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MrsPJB2007
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Member since 7/06 12020 total posts
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MJ
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by MeNBobs
Posted by evnme
Sounds like what happened during the Spanish inquisition to me.... Not as bad as convert or be killed, but still....
Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition!
I think I'm the only one who got this reference and I love it.
As for the OP - I don't see why people are getting so "offended" at the idea. Clearly with the high rate of recidivism for those who comment crimes, maybe trying something else is an idea.
It's an OPTION not forced. Who knows, maybe it could help?
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:00 PM |
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rojerono
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Member since 8/06 13803 total posts
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Jeannie
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by MeNBobs
Posted by evnme
Sounds like what happened during the Spanish inquisition to me.... Not as bad as convert or be killed, but still....
Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition!
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:07 PM |
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LightUpOurLife
Totally in love
Member since 8/06 12785 total posts
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Bonnie-Jean
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by MrsPJB2007
Posted by MeNBobs
Posted by evnme
Sounds like what happened during the Spanish inquisition to me.... Not as bad as convert or be killed, but still....
Nobody expects the Spanish inquisition!
I think I'm the only one who got this reference and I love it.
Monty!
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:14 PM |
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GioiaMia
Let's Go Rangers!
Member since 1/07 14818 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by GoldenRod
Posted by medic6809
I think the point is they are trying to get them involved in something "good". Like I said I find it hard to believe you would go to church everyday for a year and not change. I took it sorta as an outreach type program. Many have ties to the fairth, but a pull from others may have taken them away. Like I said maybe it's not for every community, but I know my community would HIGHLY benifit from trying this out! I think it's a really good idea.
We went my IL's church for a while. In just a few years, I could see the cattiness and in-fighting escalate. There was definitely a lot more bad coming out of that congregation than good. And this is from a small community church that has been around for 200 years. Putting people in a room once a week doesn't make them better or more "good".
What if the options were: Jail time, fine, or if you go to a Mosque for a year, you'll be absolved of the crime. Would people be OK with that? You don't have to convert, just sit in the Mosque once a week for a year. I have a strong feeling there would be a lot more outrage in the country about that "option".....
Nope, just wouldn't pick it. I am not outraged by anything that is not forced upon me. . . or maybe I WOULD pick it and expand my horizons. Not the worst thing in the world. No need for being OUTRAGED about ONE option.
But you said, "in this country" since I just reread it - and you are probably right. 
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:17 PM |
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TheDivineMrsM
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Mama mama mama....
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by DiamondGirl
I don't think this is a terrible idea.
My only opposition is it seems like this is geared toward just the Christian faith and to me THAT is unfair. It should encompass all faiths.
ITA. Do Jewish / Muslim / Hindu / Buddhist etc offenders have the option to attend their houses of worship, or would they have to go to church?
As long as the courts aren't demanding that a person attend services and are inclusive of other religions, I have no problem with this.
eta: Oh, and ITA - Don't commit crimes, and it won't be an issue!
Message edited 9/27/2011 12:22:05 PM.
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:21 PM |
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kimbalina
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Member since 6/08 15158 total posts
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Kim
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by evrythng4areason
eh they have three choices
1. jail
2. pay a fine
3. go to church
they get to choose their church
there's no other religious institutions in the area
it is a choice, and prison's also offer a religious component to them-how is that any different? they're not being forced to go, they're having the option
AND
think of how much money that will save their gvt..
You stated excatly what I was thinking while I was reading the article. I think it is a great option.
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:29 PM |
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Christine
2nd verse same as the 1st
Member since 5/05 15287 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by TheDivineMrsM
Posted by DiamondGirl
I don't think this is a terrible idea.
My only opposition is it seems like this is geared toward just the Christian faith and to me THAT is unfair. It should encompass all faiths.
ITA. Do Jewish / Muslim / Hindu / Buddhist etc offenders have the option to attend their houses of worship, or would they have to go to church?
As long as the courts aren't demanding that a person attend services and are inclusive of other religions, I have no problem with this.
eta: Oh, and ITA - Don't commit crimes, and it won't be an issue!
According to the article, there are no other houses of worship in this town but I think there should be an opportunity for non-Christians to perform some sort of weekly service over a year if they wish to have their records expunged.
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:31 PM |
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eroxgirl
My Loves
Member since 5/05 15697 total posts
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Rebecca
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
I don't think this is a terrible idea, but it is unconstitutional and therefore NOT okay.
I would be less bothered by it if church was an option instead of serving time BUT you still got a record, like you do with the other two options. Then I could see it as a legitimate option.
Also, this option should be available in other houses of worship. THEN and only then could it be within the guidelines of the Constitution.
I also wonder which Christian denominations this would be available in... protestant only? methodist? I don't think there is a huge Catholic population in the south either...
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:37 PM |
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AngnShaun
Sisters
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Ang
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by eroxgirl
I would be less bothered by it if church was an option instead of serving time BUT you still got a record, like you do with the other two options. Then I could see it as a legitimate option.
that is actually my biggest problem with it...
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:38 PM |
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jilliibabii
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Jillian
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by AngnShaun
Posted by eroxgirl
I would be less bothered by it if church was an option instead of serving time BUT you still got a record, like you do with the other two options. Then I could see it as a legitimate option.
that is actually my biggest problem with it...
That is definitely a huge issue with it, too.
Also, whoever mentioned doing work in soup kitchens or something like that- I think that's a better option. Then they are at least giving back something instead of just being punished by having to wake up early on a Sunday.
I also think it's completely unfair that this is basically only being offered to Catholics/Christians. If there are no mosques or snyagogues in the area, then the option is moot and that's not right.
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:45 PM |
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Erica
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by Christine
I think there should be an opportunity for non-Christians to perform some sort of weekly service over a year if they wish to have their records expunged.
As an atheist, I don't like it as an only alternative option. I wouldn't be opposed to it, if there was also an option of an hour of community service each week. I would get much more out of that, since if I picked the Church options, I would be either reading, texting or doing soduku puzzles in the back.
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| Posted 9/27/11 12:51 PM |
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stickydust
Now a mommy of 2!!!
Member since 4/06 3164 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
I think we are forgetting that this is supposed to be a PUNISHMENT and when punished you are not necessarily supposed to like your options otherwise it would not really be a punishment.
Ultimately, the question of constitutionality will be determined by the federal court but I think one can make a strong argument either way . For instance, prisoners are already deprived of constitutional freedoms so one could make an argument thatbthis punishment is an extension of prion. Prisoners do not get free speech, nor the right to bear arms, nor the right to be free in their possessions nor the right to vote etc.
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| Posted 9/27/11 1:04 PM |
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Bearcat
Love my little girls!!! <3
Member since 6/10 10818 total posts
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E
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
I think it's a first crack at what could potentially be a good idea, with some tinkering.
I seriously dislike the ACLU.
That's all.
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| Posted 9/27/11 1:21 PM |
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eroxgirl
My Loves
Member since 5/05 15697 total posts
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Rebecca
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by stickydust
I think we are forgetting that this is supposed to be a PUNISHMENT and when punished you are not necessarily supposed to like your options otherwise it would not really be a punishment.
Ultimately, the question of constitutionality will be determined by the federal court but I think one can make a strong argument either way . For instance, prisoners are already deprived of constitutional freedoms so one could make an argument thatbthis punishment is an extension of prion. Prisoners do not get free speech, nor the right to bear arms, nor the right to be free in their possessions nor the right to vote etc.
Forcing someone to choose between practicing a religion OR live with criminal record/serve jail time is beyond the scope of depriving prisoners their constitutional rights. If they go to church they're not prisoners and not even considered criminals anymore since they'll have no record. Essentially, they get off scott free. WHO in their right mind would choose jail and a criminal record over an hour of church a week?
This country is based on a separation of church and state SPECIFICALLY because where they came from they were forced to practice a specific religion OR go to jail (or be killed but I'm not trying to be dramatic).
It completely flies in the face of what we're supposed to stand for.
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| Posted 9/27/11 1:26 PM |
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DirtyBlonde
*****
Member since 11/07 7344 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
I wish George Carlin were alive to get his hands on this.
Sorry folks, I think religion is a crock of **** - and this idea is foolish.
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| Posted 9/27/11 1:34 PM |
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nrthshgrl
It goes fast. Pay attention.
Member since 7/05 57538 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
I think being locked in a monastery or convent would be more comparable.
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| Posted 9/27/11 1:37 PM |
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emilylives
biking
Member since 12/09 2163 total posts
Name:
Emily
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by eroxgirl
Posted by stickydust
I think we are forgetting that this is supposed to be a PUNISHMENT and when punished you are not necessarily supposed to like your options otherwise it would not really be a punishment.
Ultimately, the question of constitutionality will be determined by the federal court but I think one can make a strong argument either way . For instance, prisoners are already deprived of constitutional freedoms so one could make an argument thatbthis punishment is an extension of prion. Prisoners do not get free speech, nor the right to bear arms, nor the right to be free in their possessions nor the right to vote etc.
Forcing someone to choose between practicing a religion OR live with criminal record/serve jail time is beyond the scope of depriving prisoners their constitutional rights. If they go to church they're not prisoners and not even considered criminals anymore since they'll have no record. Essentially, they get off scott free. WHO in their right mind would choose jail and a criminal record over an hour of church a week?
This country is based on a separation of church and state SPECIFICALLY because where they came from they were forced to practice a specific religion OR go to jail (or be killed but I'm not trying to be dramatic).
It completely flies in the face of what we're supposed to stand for.
You said this so much better than me, even after my 4-5 attempts. Thank you!! 
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| Posted 9/27/11 1:54 PM |
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by annoyedTTCer
Posted by medic6809
Posted by AngnShaun
Posted by medic6809
I live in a city that has been raked the most violent by the FBI for many years now, and I WISH they had this option for mis. crimes. I feel it would help steer people in a better way. I also live in a more religious community and they are actively trying to bring crime down. I think the point in this is it's another option. I honestly don't know how you could go to church EVERY SINGLE Sunday and NOT make relationships with people and have that NOT effect you in a good way. I mean no disrespect, but seriously I am so over the debates about everything. It's not right, it's not fair, it's not blah blah blah....DO NOT commit the crime. Why should we have to be fair? YOU commited a crime and are being given an option. I also want to point out that it sounds like this Alabama town is much like the town I live in....grounded in Christian faith. This is Alabama not NY, and I can promise you it's not the same...not even a little. While most of you are buying Fendi, and driving BMW's, theya re using the bridge caard and driving a rust bucket because that's what they can afford. It's not a slam to anybody, but just a reality check that not everybody has the saame things many of you do. I have said it before and i'll say it again....my 1st trip to the fashion board on here was a wake up call that I wasn't in Michigan anymore.
its not right that because someone went to church for a year their crimes are forgiven.. are there harsher penalties if they do it again? im all for rehabilitation but idk what it has to do with going to church...
are the criminals from this area in Alabama... wouldnt they already have ties to Christianity? how come that didnt stop them from being criminals in the first place?
I think the point is they are trying to get them involved in something "good". Like I said I find it hard to believe you would go to church everyday for a year and not change. I took it sorta as an outreach type program. Many have ties to the fairth, but a pull from others may have taken them away. Like I said maybe it's not for every community, but I know my community would HIGHLY benifit from trying this out! I think it's a really good idea.
I'm sure plenty of bad people grew up going to church/still attend.
Going to church doesn't make you a good person.
I don't disagree that going to church doesn't "make you good", but I believe the influence is there and after time you would want to be a part of something. I'm not saying it's right for everybody, but I think it's a good option for people to have. I also think it's very specific to the area. Where I live there are no temples, no mosques. It's just not what we have. We are an old Polish Roman Catholic, German Lutheran town. Like I said I think it's a good option, and as an option it's not for everybody. I guess it comes down to you can either go to jail and have free food, cable, and "social opportunities", pay a fine, or go to church for a year. Not everybody will choose church, but I have no problems if you did.
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| Posted 9/27/11 2:23 PM |
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Otherme
Square head cutie pants
Member since 3/06 6899 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
The idea of this is so blatantly wrong to me for so many reasons
If you commit a crime, you are supposed to be PUNISHED for it.. not given an option to go to church once a week. What sort of deterrent is that??
At least a fine is monetarily painful and may cause someone to think twice before doing any more wrongdoing. But going to church??? That's basically giving an option to get off scott free
If the area where this program is being offered is more religious than here (im assuming Alabama is), wouldn't most of these people be 'god fearing, religious folk' anyway? And what good did that do them if they ended up committing the crime that got them in trouble anyway?
I can't even wrap my head around the fact that is is being offered as an option, it just seems to wrong to me.
And like another poster said - what about an option of community service instead? If you're going to give someone the option to do good instead of going to jail - at least make it something where they're giving back to the community (soup kitchen, work detail, volunteering time to help others etc) - not just an hour of sitting in church once a week. That's pathetic
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| Posted 9/27/11 2:24 PM |
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Otherme
Square head cutie pants
Member since 3/06 6899 total posts
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
Posted by medic6809
I honestly don't know how you could go to church EVERY SINGLE Sunday and NOT make relationships with people and have that NOT effect you in a good way.
Not everyone 'believes' the same way and not everyone who goes to church is a good person. Really.
Posted by medic6809
... While most of you are buying Fendi, and driving BMW's, theya re using the bridge caard and driving a rust bucket because that's what they can afford. It's not a slam to anybody, but just a reality check that not everybody has the saame things many of you do. I have said it before and i'll say it again....my 1st trip to the fashion board on here was a wake up call that I wasn't in Michigan anymore.
what on earth does this have to do with anyone having an opinion on this topic one way or the other??
Talk about sweeping generalizations..
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| Posted 9/27/11 2:30 PM |
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dpli
Daylight savings :)
Member since 5/05 13973 total posts
Name:
D
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Re: Jesus or jail? Alabama town offers options for serving time
As a person who is somewhat religious, I find it pretty insulting that weekly attendance at a house of worship is comparable to being in prison, but perhaps that is a topic for another thread.
This comment jumped out at me......
Posted by GoldenRod
He said he believes 30-day drug programs don't have the long-term capabilities to heal someone in the ways the ROC program might.
If the concern is for crimes committed by drug addicts, why not require them to go to AA, NA or some other similar program for a year? I think this would be more beneficial to an addict than attending church. I sort of get the concept, but I think the execution is all wrong.
Message edited 9/27/2011 2:53:43 PM.
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| Posted 9/27/11 2:52 PM |
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