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evrythng4areason
And then there were 4
Member since 1/10 5224 total posts
Name:
Kayla
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School vouchers
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
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Posted 2/7/17 1:50 PM  |
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BargainMama
LIF Adult
Member since 5/09 15657 total posts
Name:
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School vouchers
It's pretty bad. I'm from MI, my family lives there, and they have school of choice. All the kids from the poor performing districts flock to the higher performing, thus crowding them. Yes, there are limits to how many students can be accepted with school of choice, but its not really a good thing. Think about it. A school district isn't very good. ALL the students utilize choice..and there is hardly anyone left in their home district. Funding goes down, teachers are layed off, etc. etc....and charter schools are huge there, and most are underperforming! As of right now, no one can use a voucher to go to private school there (not a charter school...an independent private school or parochial school), and I don't see that actually happening, and it may subsidize some of the cost, but probably VERY little. I can't imagine our kids on Long Island being allowed to attend one of the private schools for free.
Message edited 2/7/2017 2:04:28 PM.
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| Posted 2/7/17 1:58 PM |
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GoldenRod
10 years on LIF!
Member since 11/06 26792 total posts
Name:
Shawn
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Re: School vouchers
I don't want my tax dollars paying for a religious school, or a for-profit charter school.
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| Posted 2/7/17 2:00 PM |
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Hofstra26
Love to Bake!
Member since 7/06 27915 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by GoldenRod
I don't want my tax dollars paying for a religious school, or a for-profit charter school.
This exactly!!!
My tax dollars should go to the schools and children in my district.
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| Posted 2/7/17 2:01 PM |
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MC09
arrrghhh!!!!
Member since 2/09 5674 total posts
Name:
Me speaks pirate!
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by GoldenRod
I don't want my tax dollars paying for a religious school, or a for-profit charter school.
This exactly!!!
My tax dollars should go to the schools and children in my district.
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| Posted 2/7/17 2:04 PM |
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RainyDay
LIF Adult
Member since 6/15 3990 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by GoldenRod
I don't want my tax dollars paying for a religious school, or a for-profit charter school.
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| Posted 2/7/17 2:06 PM |
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MrsT809
LIF Adult
Member since 9/09 12167 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Agreed.
I also don't think you can compare the private schools we're familiar with on Long Island to the large chains and other charters that are all over some cities. Many seem driven by test scores alone, not looking at the whole child or pushing for critical thinkers. Students who don't fit their mold can be shown the door. There are also lots of stories of charter schools failing or shutting their doors with no warning and no consequences. The same people that run failing schools are issues charters to go open more schools. I do think we're lucky to be in NY where hopefully local control will try to minimize the impact but in other states they are already dealing with tons of these failing schools and less oversight is certainly not going to help.
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| Posted 2/7/17 2:14 PM |
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by GoldenRod
I don't want my tax dollars paying for a religious school, or a for-profit charter school.
This exactly!!!
My tax dollars should go to the schools and children in my district.
Agreed.
I was a public school teacher in NYC for many years. At one point, I thought about moving to a charter school and did some research. In a nutshell, I learned:
- charter chains have amazing PR machines, so they can get away with claiming that they don't 'cream' their students, and take equal numbers of kids with special needs and ESL status. They don't.
- they 'counsel out' kids if they feel they will not score high enough on state exams. During my last few years at my school (and after I discarded the idea of working in a charter) we always got a handful of kids a month or before the first state test. They all came from charters.
- their approach is not sustainable for many of their kids- they work them unrealistically hard. Some charters may only end a year with about a third of the kids they started with. Some procedures I read about bordered on abuse. For example, the Success Academy schools got in hot water for not letting kids use the bathroom during tests- and they kept a supply of clothes on hand for kids who wet themselves. I believe in hard work, but I also support understanding what's age appropriate for kids.
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| Posted 2/7/17 2:44 PM |
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shadows
LIF Adult
Member since 1/10 4694 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by evrythng4areason
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
Yes. I generally support it.
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| Posted 2/7/17 6:32 PM |
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lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9511 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
I think that it would be the equivalent of what has happened in many districts when the Hasidics, who don't send their children to public schools, take over the school board.
East Ramapo School District Problems
It would be like this but on a nationwide level. I believe it would be terrible for the public school system.
I went to Catholic school almost my entire life and I think that the limited support provided to these schools from the public school system is how it should remain - give busing and access to text books when possible, and provide special ed services for those students at their designated public schools. Any more than that would really take away from the public school system.
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| Posted 2/7/17 7:01 PM |
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Naturalmama
Love my boys!!
Member since 1/12 3548 total posts
Name:
Christine
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School vouchers
I don't support vouchers and school choice. With that being said, I wish there was a way that ALL children had the right to a high quality education. Just because a child's parents can only afford to live in a suffering school district, let's say, Hempstead, I don't believe that gives the child any less of a right to a good education than the children in neighboring Garden City. Maybe I have a skewed view- I pay taxes into a school system I will never use, since we will do Catholic school through 12th grade. So, I have to honestly say it would not bother me at all to put my taxes towards helping the children of low income families receive a better education than they would get at their local school. How is that different then putting your tax dollars towards everyone having equal access to health care (which I also fully support, by the way).
I hear a lot of talk about, "I don't want my tax dollars going to any other schools but the ones in my district". Ok, fine. I can respect that. I guess I am just looking at it as- if these kids start off their lives in a crumbling and failing school district, the cycle is more likely to continue.
I am NOT saying I am for stripping funding from the public schools, and using vouchers for a free private education. I am strongly opposed to that. I just wish there was a way to allow all children to have access to a great education- regardless of where their parents can afford to live.
Message edited 2/7/2017 7:47:11 PM.
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| Posted 2/7/17 7:46 PM |
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lululu
LIF Adult
Member since 7/05 9511 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by Naturalmama
I don't support vouchers and school choice. With that being said, I wish there was a way that ALL children had the right to a high quality education. Just because a child's parents can only afford to live in a suffering school district, let's say, Hempstead, I don't believe that gives the child any less of a right to a good education than the children in neighboring Garden City. Maybe I have a skewed view- I pay taxes into a school system I will never use, since we will do Catholic school through 12th grade. So, I have to honestly say it would not bother me at all to put my taxes towards helping the children of low income families receive a better education than they would get at their local school. How is that different then putting your tax dollars towards everyone having equal access to health care (which I also fully support, by the way).
I hear a lot of talk about, "I don't want my tax dollars going to any other schools but the ones in my district". Ok, fine. I can respect that. I guess I am just looking at it as- if these kids start off their lives in a crumbling and failing school district, the cycle is more likely to continue.
I am NOT saying I am for stripping funding from the public schools, and using vouchers for a free private education. I am strongly opposed to that. I just wish there was a way to allow all children to have access to a great education- regardless of where their parents can afford to live.
I agree with this to some degree. The problem is how local you make things and how broad they are. So, say you say that everything should be equal at a state level and the per pupil spending should be equal in all the districts. The kids on Long Island would get the short end because we have to pay teachers more here than upstate. We would have fewer teachers per student and less money left over for programs. I think making the schools even on a county level is more realistic and I do think that the funds should be distributed more evenly throughout the county.
However, a lot of what also goes into the school district is parental involvement. In wealthier communities there are more single income households where one parent can dedicate more time and energy to helping out at the schools.
It's an extremely complicated issue and one that definitely affords those with more wealth to raise children who have a higher success rate as far as going on to four year colleges and advanced degrees. I don't think there is any simple solution and the solution certainly doesn't lie at the federal level or with any voucher system that is mandated nationwide.
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| Posted 2/7/17 8:33 PM |
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RainyDay
LIF Adult
Member since 6/15 3990 total posts
Name:
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School vouchers
So say we go to a voucher system.....I am going to assume that parents will still need to pay out of pocket a portion of the tuition to attend certain schools?
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| Posted 2/7/17 9:06 PM |
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PitterPatter11
Baby Boy is Here!
Member since 5/11 7619 total posts
Name:
Momma <3
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by lululu
However, a lot of what also goes into the school district is parental involvement. In wealthier communities there are more single income households where one parent can dedicate more time and energy to helping out at the schools.
It's an extremely complicated issue and one that definitely affords those with more wealth to raise children who have a higher success rate as far as going on to four year colleges and advanced degrees. I don't think there is any simple solution and the solution certainly doesn't lie at the federal level or with any voucher system that is mandated nationwide.
I am a teacher and I have similar feelings. I have been doing a lot of research on the 30 million word gap that exists by age 3 when you compare children from different economic backgrounds. I am honestly not sure what we can do about this. How can we expose these children to more words, more books, more letters, numbers, shapes, etc. There really needs to be a societial shift. I do not think school vouchers will solve this problem. It needs to start early, much earlier.
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| Posted 2/7/17 9:11 PM |
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MichLiz213
Life is Good!
Member since 7/07 7979 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by MrsT809
Agreed.
I also don't think you can compare the private schools we're familiar with on Long Island to the large chains and other charters that are all over some cities. Many seem driven by test scores alone, not looking at the whole child or pushing for critical thinkers. Students who don't fit their mold can be shown the door. There are also lots of stories of charter schools failing or shutting their doors with no warning and no consequences. The same people that run failing schools are issues charters to go open more schools. I do think we're lucky to be in NY where hopefully local control will try to minimize the impact but in other states they are already dealing with tons of these failing schools and less oversight is certainly not going to help.
To add to this, The New York Times did an incredible article about Success Academy Charter Schools in the city. Fascinating read.
Also, Roosevelt and Hempstead charter schools are doing the same or worse as the public schools in those areas (based on the test scores published by Newsday). I know test scores are not the only picture, but one would assume the way charter schools are presented to these communities that they would be doing at least better. Also, Roosevelt Charter School was cited for corruption and, for lack of a better term, being shady with their money.
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| Posted 2/7/17 9:45 PM |
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blu6385
Member since 5/08 8351 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Can someone please dumb me this down for me and explain this? I am confused on what this means. If I can get an unbiased answer that would be appreciated
And bottom line will I have no choice to pay for school no matter where they go? Because honestly I am counting down the days till my little one I in school so my daycare costs are cut dramatically.
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| Posted 2/7/17 10:16 PM |
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FirstMate
My lil cowboy
Member since 10/10 7790 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Will this voucher system really effect our public school system here on Long Island? My understanding, which is definitely rudimentary as I have not really been following this, is that schools are mostly funded and controlled by the state and that federal funding is a much smaller percentage of what the districts receive, especially if the school district is not deemed to be in a lower socioeconomic community or has a large minority make up. I did do VERY quick research and saw that in her role, she doesn't really seem to do much. Quite frankly, I don't really see the point of her position at all. The most significant thing I saw was that they oversee cases of discrimination and sexual abuse in schools and college campuses and deal with the federal funding for student loans. I didn't really see anything that would directly effect our school districts other than the potential for federal funding cuts. But, please, by all means, correct me if I am wrong.
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| Posted 2/7/17 11:59 PM |
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Sash
Peace
Member since 6/08 10312 total posts
Name:
fka LIW Smara
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Re: School vouchers
I read some of the responses so forgive me if this was already explained but don't we have this in place already. I'm in NJ and my son goes to catholic school in another county. Every year we get a form to provide our county's details and our financial information. It says it's to provide funding for the school since he is not going to his zoned public.
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| Posted 2/8/17 6:22 AM |
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ali120206
2 Boys
Member since 7/06 17792 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by lululu
I think that it would be the equivalent of what has happened in many districts when the Hasidics, who don't send their children to public schools, take over the school board.
East Ramapo School District Problems
It would be like this but on a nationwide level. I believe it would be terrible for the public school system.
I went to Catholic school almost my entire life and I think that the limited support provided to these schools from the public school system is how it should remain - give busing and access to text books when possible, and provide special ed services for those students at their designated public schools. Any more than that would really take away from the public school system.
I was thinking of East Ramapo as well. My school district borders theirs and it's horrible what the school board has done to public education. 
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| Posted 2/8/17 8:58 AM |
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eroxgirl
My Loves
Member since 5/05 15697 total posts
Name:
Rebecca
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by Sash
I read some of the responses so forgive me if this was already explained but don't we have this in place already. I'm in NJ and my son goes to catholic school in another county. Every year we get a form to provide our county's details and our financial information. It says it's to provide funding for the school since he is not going to his zoned public.
I do that too (Catholic school, Staten Island). It's not the same thing. I believe that's for certain federal programs that exist for the benefit of private schools provided they offer certain types of instruction, but it's not the same as this voucher program. What private schools receive from the government is not really considerable at all.
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| Posted 2/8/17 10:55 AM |
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LittleDiva
LIF Adult
Member since 9/11 1284 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by evrythng4areason
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
I have been researching both sides to this. Just like with anything there is good and bad. I do not think it is the end of the world. Our public education system is broken.
From my understanding, one of the main benefits is that if you are strongly opposed to common core, you could now send you child to a school that does not teach using that approach.
I am interested to see how it plays out. Our education system needs a complete overhaul. We are falling way behind the rest of the world. A little competition might not be a bad thing.
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| Posted 2/8/17 1:43 PM |
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JandJ1224
Member since 6/06 5911 total posts
Name:
Jannette
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by LittleDiva
Posted by evrythng4areason
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
I have been researching both sides to this. Just like with anything there is good and bad. I do not think it is the end of the world. Our public education system is broken.
From my understanding, one of the main benefits is that if you are strongly opposed to common core, you could now send you child to a school that does not teach using that approach.
I am interested to see how it plays out. Our education system needs a complete overhaul. We are falling way behind the rest of the world. A little competition might not be a bad thing.
I just question how someone with no experience in the public school system is the answer.
I thought it was interesting I read somewhere that I think Sanders had questioned her, if you weren't in your current financial situation would you be in front of us now for this position... and of course the answer is no.
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| Posted 2/8/17 2:15 PM |
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LittleDiva
LIF Adult
Member since 9/11 1284 total posts
Name:
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by JandJ1224
Posted by LittleDiva
Posted by evrythng4areason
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
I have been researching both sides to this. Just like with anything there is good and bad. I do not think it is the end of the world. Our public education system is broken.
From my understanding, one of the main benefits is that if you are strongly opposed to common core, you could now send you child to a school that does not teach using that approach.
I am interested to see how it plays out. Our education system needs a complete overhaul. We are falling way behind the rest of the world. A little competition might not be a bad thing.
I just question how someone with no experience in the public school system is the answer.
I thought it was interesting I read somewhere that I think Sanders had questioned her, if you weren't in your current financial situation would you be in front of us now for this position... and of course the answer is no. [/QUOTE
I don't think she is the "perfect" choice, he could have chosen better. I don't think we need someone with experience in a PUBLIC school system, just experience in education and a better track record.
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| Posted 2/8/17 2:23 PM |
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Sash
Peace
Member since 6/08 10312 total posts
Name:
fka LIW Smara
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by eroxgirl
Posted by Sash
I read some of the responses so forgive me if this was already explained but don't we have this in place already. I'm in NJ and my son goes to catholic school in another county. Every year we get a form to provide our county's details and our financial information. It says it's to provide funding for the school since he is not going to his zoned public.
I do that too (Catholic school, Staten Island). It's not the same thing. I believe that's for certain federal programs that exist for the benefit of private schools provided they offer certain types of instruction, but it's not the same as this voucher program. What private schools receive from the government is not really considerable at all.
Ahh ok, thanks for clarifying.
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| Posted 2/8/17 2:55 PM |
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JennP
LIF Adult
Member since 10/06 3986 total posts
Name:
Jenn
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Re: School vouchers
Posted by LittleDiva
Posted by JandJ1224
Posted by LittleDiva
Posted by evrythng4areason
Does anyone support this system? Granted my opinion may be skewed because I work in a private, religious school, but as a whole, the idea doesn't sound as awful to me as many make it out to be.
I have been researching both sides to this. Just like with anything there is good and bad. I do not think it is the end of the world. Our public education system is broken.
From my understanding, one of the main benefits is that if you are strongly opposed to common core, you could now send you child to a school that does not teach using that approach.
I am interested to see how it plays out. Our education system needs a complete overhaul. We are falling way behind the rest of the world. A little competition might not be a bad thing.
I just question how someone with no experience in the public school system is the answer.
I thought it was interesting I read somewhere that I think Sanders had questioned her, if you weren't in your current financial situation would you be in front of us now for this position... and of course the answer is no.
I don't think she is the "perfect" choice, he could have chosen better. I don't think we need someone with experience in a PUBLIC school system, just experience in education and a better
track record.
Respectfully, I see this so often:
"he/she is not perfect"
"he (Trump) could have made a better choice"
I feel like these phrases are used to gloss over one egregious fault after another.
Could have made a better choice? Um, yeah. Like me. Or you. Or... millions of others more qualified.
The incompetence of one after another of these fools is unprecedented and should concern - at minimum - sensible people.
Message edited 2/8/2017 3:06:22 PM.
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| Posted 2/8/17 3:05 PM |
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