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Candy Girl
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by annoyedTTCer
Posted by Gatsbygirl
Posted by jellybean1420
Posted by mamasita27
Posted by jes81276
ETA: In the article it mentions Pat-Med...that is where I went to school where the teachers have always been paid $$$. I have friends who work there now and like I said above, they started at $60-65k and within 5 years are all about $85k+. One is a gym teacher making $96k  after only 5 years...THAT is why this is a problem!
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Sorry, this is def misinformation or someone is not telling the truth. No way a teacher teaching 5 years is making $96k unless they are doing tons of coaching, coverages, etc. It's just not possible....
And can I ask, why is it ok for other professionals to make $60-90K (which on LI is a MODEST salary) and not teachers. We go to school for MINIMUM 7 years....we have master's degrees, plus some. I have 60 credits past my masters....that is ALOT of education. Why am I not entitled to a PROFESSIONAL salary????
I responded earlier, took it down but I decided to respond again 
My information is NOT incorrect. This person also does coach various sport which increases her salary to that.
That being said...most teachers on LI start out with a fair salary of $55-60k. As I said in my OP, I have friends who have only been teachers for 5-6 years who are currently making $80-85k+. That is a 25K raise over 5 years...you dont think that is insane????? Does noone see an issue with that???? Some people dont get a raise like that over 10 years.
I am not against teachers...I am not against teachers making a fair salary. But just as the administrators salaries, teachers salaries our getting out of control as well.
The theory was years ago that teachers, cops and state/govt employees made less than private company employees because they were receiving health benefits AND a pension. People who work in private companies pay for their own insurance coverage and on top of that need to contribute to their own retirement....some may be lucky to have their employer contribute.
Pat-Meds last contract was 4, 4, 4 and 4. So tack on 4% to those $80k salaries multiplied by how many teachers in the school district. THAT is a huge part of the problem.
Something has to give. The taxpayers simply cannot afford to keep paying the teachers and administrators salaries, health benefits and pensions while their children are losing their "benefits" such as activities, sports, special classes, busing, smaller class sizes, ability to attend kindergarten.
And teachers always use the fact that they have a Masters degree and continue to take classes...lets be real...teachers continue to take classes because they know it will increase their salaries even more. What a teachers pays for a class is basically given back to them in a couple of years time + some. As far as I am concerned, that money goes right back into your pockets.
And those classes keep us current with education trends and allow us to grow as educators and give your children the best experience possible!
Best experience possible?
Is that why the USA ranks behind so many other nations in the areas of science and mathematics?
We need to go to year round schooling if we are to be competitive in the furture.
Somehow I doubt the teachers unions will ever let that happen.
I think that one of the reasons the US lags behind other nations in math and science has to do with the fact that the people who are earning Master's degrees in Physics or Mathematics or Biology aren't looking to work in an industry where they are treated so badly, have to deal with a tremendous amount of red tape and aren't allowed to grow and create as scientists and mathematicians yearn to do. I work in a very large public high school in Brooklyn and there was only one physics teacher. He taught for 30 years and passed away on Thanksgiving this year. The only teacher who works with the "science kids" on Intel and Westinghouse projects also has about 30 years in and the only reason he is staying is because he feels a responsibility to the young scientists in our school. It's hard for him to walk away knowing that there is no one to replace him. He also works at a Yeshiva and is heavily involved in community affairs. I had the pleasure of getting to know him when I was asked if I would share office space with him (actually a converted supply closet with no windows/ventilation/heat etc.) when I had a small comp time position (coordinating a communications program with about 650 students-I didn't earn any extra money, I just got my own computer and printer for the 650 kids to use and taught one less class.)
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Posted 3/12/10 2:44 PM  |
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Long Island Weddings
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Mommy2Boys
My Boys!!!!
Member since 6/06 14437 total posts
Name:
C
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Pray4Baby2010
Posted by TheDivineMrsM
Alot of people work hard and spend money to get their masters and dont make as much money as teachers.
this topic is like beating a dead horse...
Point is if teachers keep getting 4% raises every year, than the students are going to keep losing. Period.
It's amazing...every year when the budget comes up there are threats to losing activities, music, gym, busing...yet when contract times comes around, teachers still manage to get their raises.
I'm a HS guidance counselor. I work for NYC, and do not get anything resembling a 4% raise each year. Not even close. (Nor do most teachers on LI districts. DH's SD settled on a 1% raise, and they were thrilled to get even that). Anyone who thinksI make too much is welcome to spend a week in my office to see what we deal with on a daily basis.
I can't deal with the anti-teacher sentiment on these boards. Yes, some teachers/counselors are wastes of space. That's true of any field. But the bulk of us are hard-working public servants that bust our butts to educate the children in YOUR life. Evenings and weekends and summers are spent planning and improving lessons, keeping up to date on the newest amendments to the state curricula, and in my case contacting colleges so my student have maximum exposure to post-secondary institutions. In general, we're not home sipping margaritas.
ITA agree that consolidating districts would save taxpayers money. In most other states, the county acts like our individual districts. The sheer number of administrators per district is staggering, and these are the people that make huge salaries and pensions. Getting rid of a few admins would certainly lower our tax bills.
This will never happpen, because FAMILIES have demonstrated time and time again that they don't want it. It won't affect teacher jobs; the number of children wouldn't change. But parents might not like their child's new classmates. (Can you imagine Bellmore Merrick merging with Roosevelt? People would be screaming like the world was about to end).
I don't know what the answer is. I can't make anyone see that educators aren't money-grubbing vultures. I can only remind people that we, like you, are hard-working LIers worthy of respect.
{{steps off soapbox}}
Thanks for reading.
I am the daughter of a teacher and I find what some of you wrote absolutely appalling.
Think back to all the teachers that you had, I know that I had a couple awful ones- but I had WAY more good ones that truly were there for me and to help me and my schoolmates.
I'm not quite sure what you found appalling about what I wrote 
I am not degrading teachers and I do not have an anti-teacher sentiment. Some teachers on this boards are so busy defending their salaries they dont listen clearly to what others are saying.
And I do not include NYC teachers in my argument about teachers salaries. I am speaking specifically of LI teachers.
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| Posted 3/12/10 3:20 PM |
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browneyedgirl
family is all that matters
Member since 6/06 6513 total posts
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browneyes
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Nifheim
I am only quoting you to answer you, i am not battling just really how i see how things needs to change with evaluating our educators. I don't think my solutions is the best, but its a solution.
Posted by browneyedgirl
how would a kindergarten teacher be rated? her kids can't write and have no clue if the teacher is doing a great job.
That is why i said a combination of elements, and yes children can comment about their teacher. I know I did at my school. I remember telling the principal in a meeting that i disliked my teacher hitting me. That is a review although its verbal.
how will a special ed teacher be evaluated? her students don't have the capabilities to evaluate her.
Yes they do unless they are severely disabled, in my school all the disabled children could either speak or write.
how will a hard teacher, who isn't very popular because she holds her class to a high standard, be evaluated FAIRLY? we all had teachers that we didn't like just because we thought they were unfair, but looking back, realize they were very effective.
In college they still have to deal with this - not every student will complain on a evaluation and they have to give specific examples and if not they usually toss the evaluation out.
how will a teacher in a tough school, whose students don't care about learning, be evaluated? she may be busting her behind and doing everything she can, but she can't change the mindsets of her students.
I agree but as I said that is why it has to be from var. sources
and as for test scores---how can you evaluate a gifted ed teacher vs a reg ed teacher vs a special ed teacher based on scores??? we ALL know whose kids will do the best.
it is one of the factors of the equation not the entire thing
some classes are "stacked" due to the effectiveness of a teacher. a really great teacher may have more low average students, who will NOT score as well on a test as a high average student. it's not the teacher's fault that she has kids who test well, or don't test well.
Same as above
and why should kindergarten student be tested to see if her teacher is effective? i don't want my kids being given MORE tests to rate their teachers. that's ridiculous.
Kindergarten do not have standardized testing? How do they get to progress to the next grade? I am not sure honestly if they don't test then its not a factor i guess.
and how can you test kids who have little to no parent involvement/low income and don't eat breakfast or lunch, etc against kids who have had tutors since kindergarten and have very involved parents?
as i said its a part of the evaluation but not the entire part
ETA--as for being reviewed by peers. i have NO idea what is happening in other classrooms or how effective a teacher is! just because she's a nice person doesn't mean she's a good teacher. so what should the principal do--take me out of MY classroom and MY kids (who will then need a sub) so that i can go evaluate another teacher? that is counterproductive! i shouldn't be taken away from my students!
I thought teachers had drop in's, i remember their was always someone coming in to evaluate the classroom EXCEPT when the teacher had tenure. This is my problem - why stop dropping in and checkin? I am not saying teachers are evil people that a greedy i completely disagree with that! I am saying every teacher needs to be checked on & evaluated. I also think when the country goes into a single program statewide for every grade this will allow progress. All kids should have the same expectations in each grade as in another state. Regents are lame - never had taken mine and i do think they are a waste.
i assume from your responses you aren't in a school position. again, so many things seem good in theory. i will do my best to respond but there's a lot going on up above
1) telling the principal your teacher hit you is NOT evaluating a teacher's skills!!! a kindergartener absolutely cannot evaluate a teacher--even the thought of it is absurd. telling the principal that something is happening to you is just that--fact. giving an opinion, at 4-5 years old, as to how a teacher delivered a lesson cannot be done correctly
2)you said "in your school". do you mean back when you were in school? or do you work in a school? i TEACH in a special ed class and all the kids CANNOT read and write!!! they are learning, but they have needs for a reason. it will take longer and different methods need to be used. yes, most can speak (although there is a large part of the special ed population that cannot) but again, they are not all able to effectively critique a teacher or her lesson. stating what the lesson was about, or whether they had fun, is NOT an evaluation. i think you are very confused as to what constitutes a teacher's skills and what would be evaluated. and many children today are must more impaired than when we were in school and most kids were sent to BOCES. now, we educate most of the population in the public school. there are kids in our classes that never would have been there 20 years ago.
3)college kids, who chose their classes and for the most part want to be there, are different than elementary aged kids who just want to play. and they are different than high school kids who may think school is stupid. can some kids evaluate? of course. but most cannot.
4) kindergarteners do not have standardized testing! even the thought is crazy. they have just started their education. they have everything to learn. can you imagine giving a test to a 4 year old? it's not even easy in second grade. preschool is not mandatory (neither is k) and many kids don't go. there are not strict standards in K the way there are in high school.
5) how did you know which of your teachers had tenure? i never did and i always knew i would be a teacher. all teachers have drop ins--tenured or not. we all have evaluations--tenured or not. the amount depends on the district. you probably just don't remember them. we never tell the kids we're being evaluated--they just think the principal is stopping by to say hi. every teacher is checked in on and evaluated.
hope that clears things up for you.
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| Posted 3/12/10 4:43 PM |
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Sweets13
Bella Bambini
Member since 5/05 9300 total posts
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by MommaG
What I don't get is why teachers wouldn't take a pay freeze - isn't keeping your job better than losing it? Aren't you making a decent amount already?
I said the same thing to DH and he said that a lot of teachers in his district including him would agree to taking a pay freeze.
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| Posted 3/12/10 5:36 PM |
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reneemarie2
LIF Infant
Member since 7/08 269 total posts
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Renee
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Sweets13
Posted by MommaG
What I don't get is why teachers wouldn't take a pay freeze - isn't keeping your job better than losing it? Aren't you making a decent amount already?
I said the same thing to DH and he said that a lot of teachers in his district including him would agree to taking a pay freeze.
Unfortunately it's not as easy as that. My cousin teaches in Lindenhurst, and I teach in another LI district. Taking a pay freeze may save jobs this year, but it will not solve the problem at hand. The district entered a contract, agreeing to the salaries, and should have budgeted for it. Next year, they'll be back to square one, and the layoffs will happen regardless. Taking a pay freeze will only weaken the union.
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| Posted 3/12/10 6:03 PM |
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MrsYank
She's here :)
Member since 4/07 3238 total posts
Name:
Mrs. Yank
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
I have tenure, I still get observed.
I teach kindergarten, I teach my kids how to read.
I also teach special ed, and I teach them how to write.
I also teach them how to be students for 6 1/2 hours a day. for every minute and make sure that everyone is getting what they need. I have to plan And there is over 20 of them. I'm also setting the foundation for them to be students for the next 16 (or so) years.
Please try it for a week and let me know how it goes.
Just and FYI- I came from a program that pretty much paid for my masters because Special Education was such a high needs area. In addition many of the people who did this program QUIT before it was over because they COULDN'T HANDLE it.
Message edited 3/12/2010 6:49:58 PM.
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| Posted 3/12/10 6:20 PM |
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jes81276
summer fun!
Member since 3/06 4962 total posts
Name:
Jaime
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by MrsYank
I also teach them how to be students for 6 1/2 hours a day. for every minute and make sure that everyone is getting what they need. I have to plan And there is over 20 of them. I'm also setting the foundation for them to be students for the next 16 (or so) years.
Please try it for a week and let me know how it goes.
I don't think many people realize that...who pays for a kids lunch when their parents don't send them with lunch money, who gives them noteboooks and pencils when none are sent in for them....who teaches them how to work with others, how to work on a team, how to treat others, etc.....
To me no one can put a price tag on those life lessons..............sorry but I feel very strongly about that. Call it what you want, but for those 6 1/2 hours a day those are MY children....I think of every one of them as my own each and every day. I am there for a month before school starts to create a learning environment that is conducive for those students...and for a good hour before school and at least a half an hour after school each day....
I am not going to sit here and cry that I am entitled to 4% raises every year (which I have NEVER gotten in my 7 years of teaching) but the budget issues go so much deeper than teacher salaries....that is why it is essential for people to be educated about budgets....there is so much misinformation - as can be seen from this thread alone.....
some people think we are paid for 12 months when we work 10
some people think a teacher makes $90k after only 5 years (only possible with lots of coaching which = lots more time working)
Message edited 3/12/2010 6:48:52 PM.
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| Posted 3/12/10 6:48 PM |
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TheDivineMrsM
2 girls 4 me!
Member since 8/08 7878 total posts
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Mama mama mama....
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Snickers
I think that one of the reasons the US lags behind other nations in math and science has to do with the fact that the people who are earning Master's degrees in Physics or Mathematics or Biology aren't looking to work in an industry where they are treated so badly, have to deal with a tremendous amount of red tape and aren't allowed to grow and create as scientists and mathematicians yearn to do.
The other difference is our national attitude towards education. Americans tend to think that more = better. In high school math classes in the US, students fly through each topic. Teachers have to teach this way; otherwise, they'd never make it through the required curriculum. Our kids learn a little bit about a lot. That's not the case in other countries. Students in Japan, India, and Jamaica actually learn fewer topics in each math class, but they go into much greater depth. Ultimately develop a better grasp of the material.
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| Posted 3/12/10 8:03 PM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Nifheim
Found on Newsday:
Terms of recently signed LI teacher contracts
November 30, 2009
Terms of recently signed teacher contracts on Long Island, as summarized by union and school district officials. In addition to these raises, each district pays most teachers annual "step" increases - generally 3 to 3.5 percent - for experience and additional education.
FLORAL PARK-BELLEROSE Three-year contract; raises of 3 percent to 3.5 percent yearly. Teachers pay a higher share of health insurance costs, and provide an additional evening conference with parents.
GREAT NECK Two years; first-year raises of $500 to $1,000 that district officials say are equivalent to a 1 percent increase. Second-year raise of 2.44 percent.
HERRICKS Five years; raises of
2 percent to 3 percent.
MIDDLE COUNTRY One-year contract extension; raise of 1.5 percent.
SACHEM Four years; raises of
1.5 percent to 2.5 percent. Union officials say annual step increases
are improved, which district officials say will be delayed in the second
and third years.
SEWANHAKA Three years; raises of 2.75 percent to 2.9 percent. Increases number of years teachers work before qualifying for health insurance in retirement.
SYOSSET Three-year extension; annual raises of 2.75 percent. Teachers give up some sick days, and pay a higher share of health insurance costs.
WEST BABYLON Four years; raises of 1.75 percent to 2.3 percent yearly. Teachers will devote more time to training and offer more extra help to students during school hours; some after-school duties eliminated for teachers.
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so let say your contract states 3% raise every year for five years, then add step and be modest at another 3% that is 6% pay raise = THAT IS INSANE
I'm confused...only ONE of the schools you listed have a 3+% raise...most are in the 1-2% range. and steps are NOT 3% - I think 2% would be more like it. That's 3-4% raise...DH got a 7% raise this year. And the opposite happens as well, when the economy is doing well and people are getting 10% raises, teachers are still only getting 3-5% (raise + step)
I will be affected by these cuts...I still have a job (thank goodness), but I will be almost doubling my work (I'm special area) - so I think that equates to a salary freeze for me.
I have to agree with a PP. We are professionals. Not many people have such scorn at what other professionals earn. Someone starting in DH's profession (systems engineer), with the same amount of schooling, would NEVER take an entry level job at 50K. They would start at 75-100K for a junior position. I welcome anyone to come and shadow me for the day.
Message edited 3/12/2010 8:04:56 PM.
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| Posted 3/12/10 8:04 PM |
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Nifheim
allo
Member since 1/09 5476 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by browneyedgirl
hope that clears things up for you.
Thank you for taking the time to answer me. But i still don't understand how evaluation based on several elements not just students, not just peers, not just admin and not just test seems unrealistic. ITS ME not getting it i feel bad its just my thinking.
I see people are quoting me and I am editing the rest of my response i had posted earlier. Teachers your rock, really you do. goodnight.
Message edited 3/12/2010 8:17:22 PM.
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| Posted 3/12/10 8:07 PM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Nifheim
I have stated with a SUNY college president makes (now they do get housing) already and teachers in 15 years can make just as much with masters and creds to PHD (president w/ phd who has been teaching for 20 yrs then went to admin) - its just a bit wacky to me.
I don't know any teacher making $172K
I do see your point. It seems elem/secondary education works backwards to higher education in regards to public vs private.
What role does publishing play into salaries? My friend (PhD and professor) says there is huge pressure to publish, but there has to be some financial benefit to it?
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| Posted 3/12/10 8:15 PM |
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Erica
What role does publishing play into salaries? My friend (PhD and professor) says there is huge pressure to publish, but there has to be some financial benefit to it?
There can be financial benefits- where my DH teaches (and I assume this is the norm at all/most colleges) you begin as an assistant and get promoted in part because of publications. It can be hard to get tenure without publications (the whole "publish or perish" thing). Other than promotion, which brings $$, I am not sure if there is additional benefit. Unless someone writes something that has the potential to become a book.
ETA- where my husband teaches, their max for full profs with PhD's is about what the NYC DOE max is, and they only go up to master's +30. 
Message edited 3/12/2010 9:18:05 PM.
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| Posted 3/12/10 9:16 PM |
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pinkandblue
Our family is complete, maybe
Member since 9/05 32436 total posts
Name:
Stephanie
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by jes81276
I don't think many people realize that...who pays for a kids lunch when their parents don't send them with lunch money, who gives them noteboooks and pencils when none are sent in for them....who teaches them how to work with others, how to work on a team, how to treat others, etc.....
To me no one can put a price tag on those life lessons..............sorry but I feel very strongly about that. Call it what you want, but for those 6 1/2 hours a day those are MY children....
you sound like an amazing teacher and let me tell you, I had a wonderful teacher in 5th grade and he made a tremendous impact on my life and I think of him alot
so thank you 
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| Posted 3/12/10 9:32 PM |
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LiLi
LIF Infant
Member since 3/09 89 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Technically, your number is deflated.. teachers only work appx 80% of the year so your range should be $75-112.5k if you are trying to compare it to a job where someone works year-round.
I wasnt going to comment to this thread but after reading through it I decided to. This is completely upsetting to see how this is being debated. I am a teacher for the last 6 years. I have not hit 60k where I am. In order for me to make more money, I have to do extra stuff at school (supervise a club or sport- which I love to do BTW and its not for the money) I may not work 12 months but I do work at night when I get home, on the weekends and on my school vacations. I do not come to school at 8 and leave at 3...my work generally comes home with me because of the enourmous amount of paperwork that we have. I am expected to know what my special needs students modifications are, how my students learn best to differentiate my lessons, and come up with lessons that motivate students who can care less about school. I also spend countless time calling parents to let them know what projects or homework their children are missing. I currently have classes with 30 students in each. I have at least 10 special educations in each of those classes. It is very difficult for one person to help those children and make sure that the other children are on task. When the students are " off task" that is when accidents can happen. To cut teachers will bring larger classes and that is not good for the benefit for the children. my school had over 1 million cut out of the budget last year. Many of our students lost the opportunity to take foreign language classes and my classes got larger. I have many wonderful students who would learn better in a smaller class setting. Classes need to be SMALLER not LARGER. Learning is far more effective in a smaller setting. This is especially true for middle and elementary school.
To lay blame on the teachers is wrong. I went into this profession because I love working with children. I have over 30k in school loans that I will be paying back way past retirement. I have to continue taking classes for raises and to keep up with current trends. I have MANY friends who didnt go to college , or went for some time and make so much more money than I do. So to say that we have inflated salaries is just wrong. We do not have inflated salaries here on LI..it is correlated to our living expenses here. For example, an average house on long island is far more expensive than a house in S. Carolina. Taxes are lower there but so are the salaries so it goes hand in hand. I have a friend who moved to NC last year, makes around 50k but her mortgage is less than 1100 a month. That is an average 1 bedroom apartment on LI. Based on that you cant compare.
Also as a tenured teacher, I get evaluated formally 2 times a year. I also have the principals walking in and out of my room all the time informally. To have the students and peers evaluate me is crazy. I wouldnt want a student who got mad at me "for giving homework and calling her parents because she was playing with her ipod in class" to evaluate me. To base teachers pay on test scores is insane too. I have ESL student who have been in this country less than 2 years and are MANDATED to take the state tests which are in ENGLISH. If i moved to a foreign country and was learning their language, I certainly wouldnt be able to pass the test. I also have many Sp Ed student who cant pass the tests. You can also factor in the students who plainly just dont give a crap about school and mark anything down on assessments just to get them finished. It would be unfair to evaluate me on that.
I know there is no simple solution to this but many people have many assumptions about teachers that are inaccurate. I know I certainly did before I became a teacher. I remember being in HS and there was a thing in my town newspaper that posted the teacher salaries. I remember being shocked to see that my English teacher was making 90K. Well little did I know, she was there 25 years and had 60 credits over her masters degree- she also supervised a club.
Many people also think that teachers sit at a desk all day and do nothing or just put up notes from the textbook for the kids to copy. I can assure you that if I ever did that at my school, tenured or not, I would find myself in the principals office having a " what not to do conversation" I buy tons of supplies for my classroom (that I dont get reinbursed for) and I give my kids pens, pencils, loose leaf and notebooks on a regular basis because many parents dont send the stuff in. I give my kids money when they dont have any for lunch. I teach middle school and this happens often.
I am a surrogate parent to many of these children and the stuff I see and the stories that I hear everyday is unreal. Its heartbreaking to hear what goes on in some of their lives outside the building. I wish everyone can spend a day in a classroom to see what its like.
As for "perks" such as medical, I pay into my health insurance every pay check. I dont get it for free. There is a plan thats free where I am but I opted to pay into mine to keep my doctors and it was better in the long run.
Edited for spelling
Message edited 3/12/2010 10:10:42 PM.
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| Posted 3/12/10 10:01 PM |
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Sassyz75
Turning a new page
Member since 5/05 9731 total posts
Name:
Dina
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
I am so torn.. teachers are such a vital VITAL part of our society.. they fulfill such an important need to take care of and teach our children...
With that said, many things on Long Island have to change.. the way costs are increasing along with taxes really makes life on Long Island unsustainable for many people.
While I understand the concept of contracts, pensions, etc.. there becomes a time when many of the items in the contract are unsustainable.
I think if teachers could meet "half way" and take some minor concessions, it would mean a lot to the tax payer (of whom many are taking a financial beating)... For example, I don't think it would be a bad thing, or unreasonable, to require teachers to pay into their health insurance more than they already do. I also think that retired teachers should have to pay more into their health insurance.
I'm probably right in assuming that health insurance costs (which constantly have double-digit percentage increases year-over-year) are a big part of the budget problem.. until Congress (yes CONGRESS.. not Obama) can get off their A55es and actually do their job... we (as a society) will be in this position for a while. Therefore, until it is resolved, I think teachers should contribute more to their health care.
I also think a PP was right in suggestion the merger of districts. The amount of administration on the Island is absolutely ridiculous.. I think combining districts would be a huge money saver.
I also think it would be beneficial to the students- to actually have a little diversity (both racial and class)... Long Island, IMO, is a very class-based society (more than race) and I think it would do a lot for the "have nots" to be mixed with the "haves".. it would teach both "sides" an important lesson.
I also think that the time for Unions is probably passed. Unions are really 20th century thinking... and I think the time has come to let go of them and move on....
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| Posted 3/12/10 10:01 PM |
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nel
LIF Adult
Member since 5/06 1173 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by MommaG
I do not think that teachers should be paid extra for every little thing they do (moderator of a club, for example). I know that is probably not a popular opinion but I don't know any other salaried employee who gets paid extra for things. If you go on a business trip or have to attend a meeting after hours, you go - you don't get paid extra. It should just be part of the job (within reason of course).
Just to address this point... there is no "overtime" in education, yet I am never out the door until an hour after the last bell rings, and if it's only an hour later, I feel like I'm leaving early. And then I go home to do more work. The only time I do get paid for those extra hours is if I'm advising a club. Sorry, but if anyone in the corporate world is at least eligible for overtime, why shouldn't I be?
As far as business trips go? I just went on a trip for three days with over 40 kids. I wasn't paid to go. It actually is not even part of my job. I do it because I care about the kids, and I help out my friend who is in charge of the trip. In my mind, this is what teaching is all about. I don't do it for the money, but I don't see why we should be begrudged a decent salary OR money for extracurriculars either.
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| Posted 3/12/10 10:05 PM |
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LiLi
LIF Infant
Member since 3/09 89 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by nel
Posted by MommaG
I do not think that teachers should be paid extra for every little thing they do (moderator of a club, for example). I know that is probably not a popular opinion but I don't know any other salaried employee who gets paid extra for things. If you go on a business trip or have to attend a meeting after hours, you go - you don't get paid extra. It should just be part of the job (within reason of course).
Just to address this point... there is no "overtime" in education, yet I am never out the door until an hour after the last bell rings, and if it's only an hour later, I feel like I'm leaving early. And then I go home to do more work. The only time I do get paid for those extra hours is if I'm advising a club. Sorry, but if anyone in the corporate world is at least eligible for overtime, why shouldn't I be?
As far as business trips go? I just went on a trip for three days with over 40 kids. I wasn't paid to go. It actually is not even part of my job. I do it because I care about the kids, and I help out my friend who is in charge of the trip. In my mind, this is what teaching is all about. I don't do it for the money, but I don't see why we should be begrudged a decent salary OR money for extracurriculars either.
ITA...and to add, many people who go on business trips get stipends for food and entertainment.
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| Posted 3/12/10 10:13 PM |
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Palebride
I am an amazing bakist
Member since 5/05 13673 total posts
Name:
Lori
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Nifheim
Question what do Steps mean?
Like is step one = to first year on the job
step 10 = 10 years on the job?
Also when your contract says MA +15 does that mean Master plus 15 creds to dr?
You're right about the steps. I have been teaching for 8 years, but I'm on the 7th step because my first year was not a tenure-track position (part time).
And the +15,30,45, etc. means credits you have past your Masters.
Another note....if you're looking for information on school districts....please don't go to Newsday for your information - they are notorious for being anti-teacher. If you are looking for information, and are concerned....go to your local school board meeting. Ask questions to get your answers.
And finally....teachers' salaries are a small part of a budget....costs to keep the building itself running are increasing, so budgets will have to as well. It's just common sense.
This whole thread makes me sad. I happen to work in a higher paying LI district. And I earn every darn penny I make in my paycheck.
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| Posted 3/12/10 10:34 PM |
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BaroqueMama
Chase is one!
Member since 5/05 27530 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
I'm still not understanding why teachers are getting the blame for the budget issues?
They don't set the budgets for salaries. They also don't necessarily have a say in whether or not they take a pay freeze. In fact, most times they have no say in any of this at all. Their salaries are not the problem, as far as I'm concerned. The bureaucracy above them and all around them is bleeding us all dry. There are so many more issues going on with our education system, and it's not the fault of the teachers. Are there terrible teachers out there that make a ton of money? Yeah, but look at corporate America. Look at all the banks folding from greedy people at the top. It happens everywhere.
I just find it hard to believe that people could point their fingers at teachers as some greedy, money hungry heathens when the reality is, they are doing a job and it's the pay scale that was set in place way before they came along, so how are they to blame? I mean, can anyone else tell me that when they got into their career, if there was a way to advance and make more money, they just didn't take it because they felt it was overcompensation for what they do? Hell no. We all value ourselves and our jobs and all of our jobs command X amount of dollars. If a LI teacher generally makes X amount of dollars, why should anyone expect NOT to make that? It just seems like a ridiculous thing to me.
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| Posted 3/12/10 11:03 PM |
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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Honestly, I don't see how teacher's taking a pay cut or freeze would solve the problem in anyway MAINLY for the reason that all that would do is put that money right back into the hands of the people who couldn't really manage it to start with.
I don't know anything about the school system specifically, but assuming that the business is run like any other I'd be hesitant, too, to offer up my money to those that mismanaged it in the first place and expect that it would actually be used in the way that it was intended.
And, ITA about consolidating at the top.
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| Posted 3/12/10 11:39 PM |
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twicethefun
Loving life
Member since 7/06 4088 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by Babyaholic
Tough economic times for everyone. Why should teachers be exempt from lay-offs and pay freezes?
As a teacher, I would be more concerned about the children than the teachers. THis will mean larger class size, less specials and an all round poorer quality education for chldren. That's why.
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| Posted 3/13/10 4:46 AM |
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twicethefun
Loving life
Member since 7/06 4088 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by jellybean1420
Posted by mamasita27
Posted by jes81276
ETA: In the article it mentions Pat-Med...that is where I went to school where the teachers have always been paid $$$. I have friends who work there now and like I said above, they started at $60-65k and within 5 years are all about $85k+. One is a gym teacher making $96k after only 5 years...THAT is why this is a problem!
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Sorry, this is def misinformation or someone is not telling the truth. No way a teacher teaching 5 years is making $96k unless they are doing tons of coaching, coverages, etc. It's just not possible....
And can I ask, why is it ok for other professionals to make $60-90K (which on LI is a MODEST salary) and not teachers. We go to school for MINIMUM 7 years....we have master's degrees, plus some. I have 60 credits past my masters....that is ALOT of education. Why am I not entitled to a PROFESSIONAL salary????
I responded earlier, took it down but I decided to respond again
My information is NOT incorrect. This person also does coach various sport which increases her salary to that.
That being said...most teachers on LI start out with a fair salary of $55-60k. As I said in my OP, I have friends who have only been teachers for 5-6 years who are currently making $80-85k+. That is a 25K raise over 5 years...you dont think that is insane????? Does noone see an issue with that???? Some people dont get a raise like that over 10 years.
I am not against teachers...I am not against teachers making a fair salary. But just as the administrators salaries, teachers salaries our getting out of control as well.
The theory was years ago that teachers, cops and state/govt employees made less than private company employees because they were receiving health benefits AND a pension. People who work in private companies pay for their own insurance coverage and on top of that need to contribute to their own retirement....some may be lucky to have their employer contribute.
Pat-Meds last contract was 4, 4, 4 and 4. So tack on 4% to those $80k salaries multiplied by how many teachers in the school district. THAT is a huge part of the problem.
Something has to give. The taxpayers simply cannot afford to keep paying the teachers and administrators salaries, health benefits and pensions while their children are losing their "benefits" such as activities, sports, special classes, busing, smaller class sizes, ability to attend kindergarten.
And teachers always use the fact that they have a Masters degree and continue to take classes...lets be real...teachers continue to take classes because they know it will increase their salaries even more. What a teachers pays for a class is basically given back to them in a couple of years time + some. As far as I am concerned, that money goes right back into your pockets.
Actually new teachers have to take classes so that they can teach. There is no more permanent certification, they must continue their education.
I think when someone has 10+ yrs experience on a job with a higher education they should make enough to live independenty in near the area they work. I don't get it. 80, 000 is not overly extravagant, in my opinion. We can barely survive here on LI and my dh's and my salary combined is more than that.
I don't know any experienced, educated person making less than that...unless, of course they lost their job.
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| Posted 3/13/10 5:14 AM |
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twicethefun
Loving life
Member since 7/06 4088 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Posted by KittyGags
I didn't read through everyone's posts...but would not paying teachers over the summer enable them to keep more jobs? Just curious?
I know obviously the biggest problem is the ton of money superintendents/administrators are making but I've always thought getting paid over the summer when you're not working is ummm....interesting?
Maybe I'm just jealous!
Teachers don't get paid over the summer, their salary gets divided either by 10 or twelve.
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| Posted 3/13/10 5:18 AM |
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twicethefun
Loving life
Member since 7/06 4088 total posts
Name:
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Message edited 3/13/2010 5:30:31 AM.
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| Posted 3/13/10 5:28 AM |
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VirginiaDeb
Don't eat me, hippo!
Member since 5/05 9252 total posts
Name:
Deb
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Re: Teachers Islandwide face layoffs in budget crunch - 59 teachers were given notices in Lindenhurst
Down in VA we're going on year #2 w/o a step or COLA increase. Last year we chose to save jobs over a pay increase, this year we did not, but that's what they're choosing anyways.
Next year I'll likely be teaching a combination class (we're likely losing 1 or 2 classroom positions).
To make up for all of our snow days they considered adding time to each school day which would have gone beyond our current contract by 2 days... When our superintendent was asked how it was fair to give us more days w/o any kind of pay raise he said "well they had off for a week, why are they complaining?"
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| Posted 3/13/10 10:09 AM |
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