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Katareen
5,000 Posts!
Member since 4/10 7180 total posts
Name:
Katherine
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by Mrs213
Posted by sameinitials
I don't think this is a drama topic at all - take it being a "teacher" out of the equation... would you want your doctor caring for your while potentially high on heroin, or your child's day care provider, or your lawyer, or your bus driver? It doesn't have anything to do with them being a teacher per se, but rather about a person with a certain responsibility doing his/her job while on heroin.
Ita I think teachers should be held to a high standard, heroin in the bathroom is unacceptable and I'm not sure how there is even a debate here...
Very true , so far every teacher is even  over the whole thing. Heroin users do not belong in schools, and why are the teachers who were seen in the bathroom not chomping at the bit to clear their names despite the union's recommendation ?
I agree--if I were innocent I would demand I be tested to be sure I wasn't falsely accused of being involved.
If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to hide. These people are in charge of very young children and if I were a parent in that school I'd have a difficult time sending my kids in until I knew what was going on.
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Posted 2/21/14 10:00 AM  |
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by klingklang77
This needs a warning attached to it. My browser has now visited a fox news site, *blech*.
That's what I was thinking!!!!  I thought for sure my iPad would explode from shock!
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:00 AM |
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
They should have offered up drug tests to clear themselves right away. Sometimes I feel like unions are combative just for the sake of doing it. This is one case where they should step aside and encourage cooperation.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:01 AM |
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Sweetlax22
LIF Adult
Member since 5/10 1904 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:03 AM |
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PrincessP
Big sister!!!!!!!!!!
Member since 12/05 17450 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by Mrs213
Posted by sameinitials
I don't think this is a drama topic at all - take it being a "teacher" out of the equation... would you want your doctor caring for your while potentially high on heroin, or your child's day care provider, or your lawyer, or your bus driver? It doesn't have anything to do with them being a teacher per se, but rather about a person with a certain responsibility doing his/her job while on heroin.
Ita I think teachers should be held to a high standard, heroin in the bathroom is unacceptable and I'm not sure how there is even a debate here...
Very true , so far every teacher is even over the whole thing. Heroin users do not belong in schools, and why are the teachers who were seen in the bathroom not chomping at the bit to clear their names despite the union's recommendation ?
I agree. But I also think that as I stated above there should be random drug tests regardless of this incident. If we are going to say we don't want drugs used around children, then it can't be just when heroin is found in the bathroom. Which I probably think is the unions position, maybe....
Also, realistically all four teachers can be drug users. Doesn't mean they found the culprit with needles in the bathroom.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:04 AM |
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PrincessP
Big sister!!!!!!!!!!
Member since 12/05 17450 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
exactly.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:04 AM |
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MsSissy
xoxoxo
Member since 3/07 39159 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
I took that to mean they can take the test on their own time.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:06 AM |
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Sweetlax22
LIF Adult
Member since 5/10 1904 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by MsSissy
Posted by Sweetlax22
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
I took that to mean they can take the test on their own time.
Not sure I see what you are saying, like take the test just as a person and not "union member"?
susibee?
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:17 AM |
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jessnbrian
Only God knows His plan for us
Member since 4/13 7238 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by PrincessP
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by Mrs213
Posted by sameinitials
I don't think this is a drama topic at all - take it being a "teacher" out of the equation... would you want your doctor caring for your while potentially high on heroin, or your child's day care provider, or your lawyer, or your bus driver? It doesn't have anything to do with them being a teacher per se, but rather about a person with a certain responsibility doing his/her job while on heroin.
Ita I think teachers should be held to a high standard, heroin in the bathroom is unacceptable and I'm not sure how there is even a debate here...
Very true , so far every teacher is even over the whole thing. Heroin users do not belong in schools, and why are the teachers who were seen in the bathroom not chomping at the bit to clear their names despite the union's recommendation ?
I agree. But I also think that as I stated above there should be random drug tests regardless of this incident. If we are going to say we don't want drugs used around children, then it can't be just when heroin is found in the bathroom. Which I probably think is the unions position, maybe....
Also, realistically all four teachers can be drug users. Doesn't mean they found the culprit with needles in the bathroom.
Most teachers are aware that they are SUBJECT TO RANDOM AND UNANNOUNCED DRUG TESTS. Actually, most municipal employees (town/village office workers, teachers, cops, hospital workers) actually sign something in their contracts that they are subject to random and unannounced drug tests.
Honestly, if they ARE using illegal drugs during their free time, then they should be held accountable to that. Drink Alcohol, fine, if marijuana is legal in your state, smoke a little pot - you're held accountable for anything else you do during your free time that is illegal, you should ABSOLUTELY be held accountable for illegal drug use during your free time.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:36 AM |
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MsSissy
xoxoxo
Member since 3/07 39159 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by MsSissy
Posted by Sweetlax22
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
I took that to mean they can take the test on their own time.
Not sure I see what you are saying, like take the test just as a person and not "union member"?
susibee?
Yes. But going back and reading it again. I can see how it could mean something else.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:43 AM |
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Sweetlax22
LIF Adult
Member since 5/10 1904 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by jessnbrian
Posted by PrincessP
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by Mrs213
Posted by sameinitials
I don't think this is a drama topic at all - take it being a "teacher" out of the equation... would you want your doctor caring for your while potentially high on heroin, or your child's day care provider, or your lawyer, or your bus driver? It doesn't have anything to do with them being a teacher per se, but rather about a person with a certain responsibility doing his/her job while on heroin.
Ita I think teachers should be held to a high standard, heroin in the bathroom is unacceptable and I'm not sure how there is even a debate here...
Very true , so far every teacher is even over the whole thing. Heroin users do not belong in schools, and why are the teachers who were seen in the bathroom not chomping at the bit to clear their names despite the union's recommendation ?
I agree. But I also think that as I stated above there should be random drug tests regardless of this incident. If we are going to say we don't want drugs used around children, then it can't be just when heroin is found in the bathroom. Which I probably think is the unions position, maybe....
Also, realistically all four teachers can be drug users. Doesn't mean they found the culprit with needles in the bathroom.
Most teachers are aware that they are SUBJECT TO RANDOM AND UNANNOUNCED DRUG TESTS. Actually, most municipal employees (town/village office workers, teachers, cops, hospital workers) actually sign something in their contracts that they are subject to random and unannounced drug tests.
Honestly, if they ARE using illegal drugs during their free time, then they should be held accountable to that. Drink Alcohol, fine, if marijuana is legal in your state, smoke a little pot - you're held accountable for anything else you do during your free time that is illegal, you should ABSOLUTELY be held accountable for illegal drug use during your free time.
I am a teacher and did not know this, I guess it doesn't matter to me since they can test me all they want and find nothing illegal.
If this is the case with the teachers in question I can't see how they can't be forced to take the test. Maybe a "good" lawyer could argue that this case it is not considered "random" ? Depends on how things are worded in the contract.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:46 AM |
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PrincessP
Big sister!!!!!!!!!!
Member since 12/05 17450 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by jessnbrian
Posted by PrincessP
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by Mrs213
Posted by sameinitials
I don't think this is a drama topic at all - take it being a "teacher" out of the equation... would you want your doctor caring for your while potentially high on heroin, or your child's day care provider, or your lawyer, or your bus driver? It doesn't have anything to do with them being a teacher per se, but rather about a person with a certain responsibility doing his/her job while on heroin.
Ita I think teachers should be held to a high standard, heroin in the bathroom is unacceptable and I'm not sure how there is even a debate here...
Very true , so far every teacher is even over the whole thing. Heroin users do not belong in schools, and why are the teachers who were seen in the bathroom not chomping at the bit to clear their names despite the union's recommendation ?
I agree. But I also think that as I stated above there should be random drug tests regardless of this incident. If we are going to say we don't want drugs used around children, then it can't be just when heroin is found in the bathroom. Which I probably think is the unions position, maybe....
Also, realistically all four teachers can be drug users. Doesn't mean they found the culprit with needles in the bathroom.
Most teachers are aware that they are SUBJECT TO RANDOM AND UNANNOUNCED DRUG TESTS. Actually, most municipal employees (town/village office workers, teachers, cops, hospital workers) actually sign something in their contracts that they are subject to random and unannounced drug tests.
Honestly, if they ARE using illegal drugs during their free time, then they should be held accountable to that. Drink Alcohol, fine, if marijuana is legal in your state, smoke a little pot - you're held accountable for anything else you do during your free time that is illegal, you should ABSOLUTELY be held accountable for illegal drug use during your free time.
oh, I had asked on the first page and a few people had said this doesn't happen.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:46 AM |
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Sweetlax22
LIF Adult
Member since 5/10 1904 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by MsSissy
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by MsSissy
Posted by Sweetlax22
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
I took that to mean they can take the test on their own time.
Not sure I see what you are saying, like take the test just as a person and not "union member"?
susibee?
Yes. But going back and reading it again. I can see how it could mean something else.
Same here lol
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:47 AM |
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sfp0701
Liam's Mommy!
Member since 1/07 9764 total posts
Name:
Tricia
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by PrincessP
Personally, I'd have to hear from a current teacher and the process/screening that is used when hiring and throughout. I mean is random drug tests done on teachers? If so, then the school seems to have a right to do this at any time. I would like to think there was random drug testing in schools so that teachers are on their feet. Like, I said I don't know the rules and regs in schools so I can't comment on this case in particular.
No drug testing in my district upon hiring or while an employee. I don't have a problem with drug testing. The only possible reason that I can think of the union telling them not to test is that it would set a precedent and possibly lead to random drug testing? Again, I wouldn't have a problem with that. But, maybe some people would.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:52 AM |
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jessnbrian
Only God knows His plan for us
Member since 4/13 7238 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
If you are a public school NYS teacher, read through either your employee handbook or contract THOROUGHLY. Most of my friends are teachers, and maybe it's just their districts in nassau and suffolk, as public school teachers (it's likely different for private schools) they are subject to drug tests if it is deemed necessary... In fact, they had to have drug clearance to even get hired. So does my mom, she works in a village court as a court clerk, so did my brother as a sanitation worker (he's now a teacher).
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:52 AM |
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KarenK122
The Journey is the Destination
Member since 5/05 4431 total posts
Name:
Karen
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Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Any job that deals with the public should be given random drug testing. Police officers, firefighters, teachers, etc. should not be under the influence of illegal drugs at any time. My job at an investment bank gave random drug testing. It was part of our morality clause.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:53 AM |
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SusiBee
. . . . .
Member since 3/09 8268 total posts
Name:
S
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by MsSissy
Posted by Sweetlax22
What they do on their own time is no one's business, but what they do during working hours is the municipality's business.
Is it??? Another interesting debate.
This is the only reason I can mayyyyybe see why there is an objection , a drug test cannot prove if the drug (any drug) was used during school hours or not. Not that doing drugs while not at work is ok either.......
I took that to mean they can take the test on their own time.
Not sure I see what you are saying, like take the test just as a person and not "union member"?
susibee?
Not quite the meaning.
Union is there to advise them. The teachers can go against what their union tells them if they feel that it is wrong. My opinion is that their union reps are playing a dangerous game here, that they have no idea what to do/say in this particular situation.
The teachers can and should all take the test to substantiate their innocence. I know from the bus company that random testing is done on company time.
If I were innocent of the charges, I would definitely want to take a drug test instead of getting dragged thru the mud and my name being ruined.
That drug paraphernalia was found on school property means that someone is shooting up on school time.
If "I" shot up only at home, why would I take the stuff to my office ?
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:54 AM |
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DiamondGirl
You are my I love you
Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
Name:
DiamondMama
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
You are really and truly obsessed with teachers
That said I do agree the teachers should take the drug test.
My union says I do not need to be drug tested, so if that is what their union says the union is going to tell them not to bc thats how unions are you DON'T HAVE to do something they tell you not to--that said in THIS situation where someone WAS using drugs in a teachers bathroom I think any professional who is innocent would gladly take the test.
Why in the hell would anyone want people to even THINK they MIGHT be doing heroin in the bathroom? Why would anyone protect a colleague who is endangering children by agreeing not to take the test along with the guilty party?
I have to agree with OP, obsessed as he is with all things teacher, I would not want my kid attending that school either.
Message edited 2/21/2014 10:55:42 AM.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:54 AM |
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missfabulous
#mommyneedswine
Member since 6/09 10031 total posts
Name:
Colleen
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by KarenK122
Any job that deals with the public should be given random drug testing. Police officers, firefighters, teachers, etc. should not be under the influence of illegal drugs at any time. My job at an investment bank gave random drug testing. It was part of our morality clause.
I completely agree with this. Its a safety issue and also illegal!
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:55 AM |
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jessnbrian
Only God knows His plan for us
Member since 4/13 7238 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
I am a teacher and did not know this, I guess it doesn't matter to me since they can test me all they want and find nothing illegal.
If this is the case with the teachers in question I can't see how they can't be forced to take the test. Maybe a "good" lawyer could argue that this case it is not considered "random" ? Depends on how things are worded in the contract.
Honestly, it doesn't matter to me either, when I work someplace that includes in the contract/employee handbook. I only knew about it well because when I worked in the hospital, I worked in HR, so I know now to read my contracts and employee handbooks cover to cover and in between the lines. Also, DH had to do a drug screen for his current job - he's a civil engineer.
I think that's the point though, isn't it? They interact with our children, shouldn't they be held to a higher standard? If you are getting high every night and coming in hung over, what example are you setting for these impressionable kids?
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:57 AM |
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DiamondGirl
You are my I love you
Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
Name:
DiamondMama
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by jessnbrian
If you are a public school NYS teacher, read through either your employee handbook or contract THOROUGHLY. Most of my friends are teachers, and maybe it's just their districts in nassau and suffolk, as public school teachers (it's likely different for private schools) they are subject to drug tests if it is deemed necessary... In fact, they had to have drug clearance to even get hired. So does my mom, she works in a village court as a court clerk, so did my brother as a sanitation worker (he's now a teacher).
I work for nYC DOE and I did not need to be drug tested to get my job only fingerprinted and background check.
I would imagine that if there was suspicion--serious evidence-- they COULD drug test me, and honestly I think that in this case they SHOULD be able to.
ETA: I always have found it amazing that my husband works in corporate America needs to pass a drug test but educators do not (at least in NYC). The UFT is a strong union though so it does not surprise me in that way, their belief is we are a "Union of Professionals" and we shouldn't be subjected to that.
Message edited 2/21/2014 10:59:48 AM.
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| Posted 2/21/14 10:57 AM |
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jessnbrian
Only God knows His plan for us
Member since 4/13 7238 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by DiamondGirl
Posted by jessnbrian
If you are a public school NYS teacher, read through either your employee handbook or contract THOROUGHLY. Most of my friends are teachers, and maybe it's just their districts in nassau and suffolk, as public school teachers (it's likely different for private schools) they are subject to drug tests if it is deemed necessary... In fact, they had to have drug clearance to even get hired. So does my mom, she works in a village court as a court clerk, so did my brother as a sanitation worker (he's now a teacher).
I work for nYC DOE and I did not need to be drug tested to get my job only fingerprinted and background check.
I would imagine that if there was suspicion--serious evidence-- they COULD drug test me, and honestly I think that in this case they SHOULD be able to.
ETA: I always have found it amazing that my husband works in corporate America needs to pass a drug test but educators do not (at least in NYC). The UFT is a strong union though so it does not surprise me in that way, their belief is we are a "Union of Professionals" and we shouldn't be subjected to that.
NYC is slightly different, but I'd be surprised if there wasn't some sort of clause in your contract that allowed for it... but NYC DOE is TOTALLY different than nassau and suffolk. Like you said, the union there is so strong, I mean, where in any other district a teacher would be fired, in NYC the teacher is pulled from the room and kept on staff elsewhere and continuously paid. My experience with NYC DOE is that it's a whole heck of a lot more corrupt (for lack of a better word), at least corrupt in different ways.
My stepmother is a NYC teacher, and has been for 30 or so years. She wouldn't leave the city for anything, but it has definitely taken it's toll on her. She lost twins at 6 months about 17 years ago, and I think she is STILL paying back the time-off she had to take, all because she didn't bring home a live baby.
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| Posted 2/21/14 11:05 AM |
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Sweetlax22
LIF Adult
Member since 5/10 1904 total posts
Name:
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by jessnbrian
Posted by Sweetlax22
I am a teacher and did not know this, I guess it doesn't matter to me since they can test me all they want and find nothing illegal.
If this is the case with the teachers in question I can't see how they can't be forced to take the test. Maybe a "good" lawyer could argue that this case it is not considered "random" ? Depends on how things are worded in the contract.
Honestly, it doesn't matter to me either, when I work someplace that includes in the contract/employee handbook. I only knew about it well because when I worked in the hospital, I worked in HR, so I know now to read my contracts and employee handbooks cover to cover and in between the lines. Also, DH had to do a drug screen for his current job - he's a civil engineer.
I think that's the point though, isn't it? They interact with our children, shouldn't they be held to a higher standard? If you are getting high every night and coming in hung over, what example are you setting for these impressionable kids?
Teachers should be tested like other employees, but I have never heard of it being done anywhere.
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| Posted 2/21/14 11:19 AM |
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jessnbrian
Only God knows His plan for us
Member since 4/13 7238 total posts
Name:
Jessica
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Re: Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
Posted by Sweetlax22
Posted by jessnbrian
Posted by Sweetlax22
I am a teacher and did not know this, I guess it doesn't matter to me since they can test me all they want and find nothing illegal.
If this is the case with the teachers in question I can't see how they can't be forced to take the test. Maybe a "good" lawyer could argue that this case it is not considered "random" ? Depends on how things are worded in the contract.
Honestly, it doesn't matter to me either, when I work someplace that includes in the contract/employee handbook. I only knew about it well because when I worked in the hospital, I worked in HR, so I know now to read my contracts and employee handbooks cover to cover and in between the lines. Also, DH had to do a drug screen for his current job - he's a civil engineer.
I think that's the point though, isn't it? They interact with our children, shouldn't they be held to a higher standard? If you are getting high every night and coming in hung over, what example are you setting for these impressionable kids?
Teachers should be tested like other employees, but I have never heard of it being done anywhere.
I know a lot of places put it in the contracts, but don't actually do it. I know none of my friends have actually been tested, but they know that they COULD be tested. I totally agree with you though, they absolutely should be tested.
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| Posted 2/21/14 11:21 AM |
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bunnyluck
LIF Adult
Member since 1/14 3196 total posts
Name:
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Elementary School Teachers - Heroin
I don't see a problem with drug testing. But I am also not a drug user.... I am in private sector and I have signed papers before I was onboarded that state I can be asked to submit to a drug test at any time during my employment. I have never heard it happening though at my company... No skin off my back if it did.
As a side note, I know way too many LI and NYC school teachers who could NOT pass a drug test.
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| Posted 2/21/14 11:49 AM |
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