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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
of COURSE we have social programs already that cost billions of $'s. no one is disputing that  we are not a perfect Democracy, no country is. but we're not a Socialist society either, for now anyway!
Exactly.
I don't know what you're basing the theory that "republicans won't admit to it". We do have socialist programs... so? Just b/c republicans are fiscally conservative, it doesn't mean that they subscribe to the idea that it's Every man for themself, so why do people try to make it out that way?
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Posted 10/26/08 12:30 AM  |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
Posted by smdl
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
Posted by smdl
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
Posted by babymakes3
Giving short term money to someone who has earned money for themselves and has put into the pot is different than giving long term money to those who won't go out and earn it themselves.
exactly. what is so hard to understand here 
I think you guys are COMPLETELY missing the point I was making!!!!
Taking money away from my paycheck for ANYONE unemployed IS spreading the wealth ALREADY.
Taking money away from my paycheck to pay for public schools IS spreading the wealth ALREADY.
yes it is, that's why their called "social programs"
what Obama wants to do is take even MORE money from those who worked their azzes off and use it to give other people a tax break.
AGAIN my point was NOT about Obama and his program but about our current system. That we DO have social programs indeed like you just said. And that those in concept are MORE Democratic in nature.
this thread didn't have to be 2 pages if you just made that statement.
of COURSE we have social programs already that cost billions of $'s. no one is disputing that we are not a perfect Democracy, no country is. but we're not a Socialist society either, for now anyway!
Well, I NEVER said I was endorsing Obama. It was assuming I was. 
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:31 AM |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by neenie
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
of COURSE we have social programs already that cost billions of $'s. no one is disputing that we are not a perfect Democracy, no country is. but we're not a Socialist society either, for now anyway!
Exactly.
I don't know what you're basing the theory that "republicans won't admit to it". We do have socialist programs... so? Just b/c republicans are fiscally conservative, it doesn't mean that they subscribe to the idea that it's Every man for themself, so why do people try to make it out that way?
Because I saw a cartoon doing a parody of Obama and wanted to point it out that we do have social programs system already in place that are Democratic in basis.
So I wanted people to reflect on this and realize that we have them already indeed. Whether you are for Obama or not.
Just an eye opener!!!
I did not need 2 pages of people bashing Obama. That is NOT what I did but the way posters made it to be to try to prove to me that Obama was the bad guy.
I can't help it if people misunderstood were this thread was going and ran wild with it.. Nowhere did I say it was a pro Obama post.
So guys... blame yourself for creating 2 pages of Obama bashing that nobody asked for.
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:36 AM |
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HelenZ
So worth the wait :)
Member since 10/07 2862 total posts
Name:
Helen
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by smdl
So NOBODY agrees that the system we have NOW has a Democratic aspect to it ALREADY.
I agree with you!! this so called "spread the wealth" concept is what our taxes have been doing for a long long time.........the protesting now is only due to the outcry from those who have benefited from tax breaks on higher incomes under our republican president. if I recall the poll results of what I posted last week, about 85-90% of LIFer's who participated made less than the income that would be liable to an increase in taxes.....not sure where your point is being lost here, since its pretty obvious our tax dollars have always been allocated to welfare or unemployment programs, it's not only people in the highest tax bracket paying into these programs, its all of us. I have never used unemployment benefits (hope I don't have to anytime soon either!!), but if I ever needed them I'm glad there are such programs in place for all Americans!
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:37 AM |
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LittleBlueBug
Happy Mommy
Member since 9/06 4074 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Not trying to stir the pot, but was anyone UNaware that we had some social programs?
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:40 AM |
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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by smdl
I did not need 2 pages of people bashing Obama. That is NOT what I did but the way posters made it to be to try to prove to me that Obama was the bad guy.
I can't help it if people misunderstood were this thread was going and ran wild with it.. Nowhere did I say it was a pro Obama post.
So guys... blame yourself for creating 2 pages of Obama bashing that nobody asked for.
I didnt engage in any Obama bashing, so if you're implying that, i think that you're out of line. I like Obama- though i disagree with his policies. I used his site as a source to support the example that i gave when responding to your question. I didnt interpret this as a pro-obama thread, i interpreted it as a "the jokes on you, republicans, because we already have socialist policies in america." Still, i wasn't offended, but to say that there was any Obama "bashing" is really a stretch, imo.
Message edited 10/26/2008 12:46:52 AM.
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:45 AM |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by LittleBlueBug
Not trying to stir the pot, but was anyone UNaware that we had some social programs?
It was a REMINDER that we do pay taxes and contribute for programs ALREADY in place that spread the wealth to needy people ALREADY!
Did I say ALREADY enough times tonight? 
Whether we pay more of less taxes, we do spread the weath ALREADY regardless of the President.
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:46 AM |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by neenie
Posted by smdl
I did not need 2 pages of people bashing Obama. That is NOT what I did but the way posters made it to be to try to prove to me that Obama was the bad guy.
I can't help it if people misunderstood were this thread was going and ran wild with it.. Nowhere did I say it was a pro Obama post.
So guys... blame yourself for creating 2 pages of Obama bashing that nobody asked for.
I didnt engage in any Obama bashing, so if you're implying that, i think that you're out of line. I like Obama- though i disagree with his policies. I used his site as a source to support the example that i gave when responding to your question. I didnt interpret this as a pro-obama thread, i interpreted it as a "the jokes on you, republicans, because we already have socialist policies in america." Still, i wasn't offended, but to say that there was any Obama "bashing" is really a stretch, imo.
Actually it was not directly at you personally. How am I out of line? Come on!!! Let's not turn this into an uncivilized thread.
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:48 AM |
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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by smdl
Posted by neenie
I didnt engage in any Obama bashing, so if you're implying that, i think that you're out of line.
Actually it was not directly at you personally. How am I out of line? Come on!!! Let's not turn this into an uncivilized thread.
I said that i felt it was out of line if you were implying that *I* was. I can only speak for myself. You weren't, so obivously you weren't out of line 
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:52 AM |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by neenie
Posted by smdl
Posted by neenie
I didnt engage in any Obama bashing, so if you're implying that, i think that you're out of line.
Actually it was not directly at you personally. How am I out of line? Come on!!! Let's not turn this into an uncivilized thread.
I said that i felt it was out of line if you were implying that *I* was. I can only speak for myself. You weren't, so obivously you weren't out of line
I try to stay civilized in my "debates".
Although this was not a Democrats vs Republicans debate. And def. not a Republican bashing thread.
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:54 AM |
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passerby
LIF Zygote
Member since 8/08 47 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
I read the thread and don't think there was any Obama bashing. You presented a question and people where giving you an answer, maybe it was not the answer you wanted but they did answer.
There are many programs that take our money and redistribute it, but remember there have been both Democrats and Republicans in office over the years.
I think that amount we are tax is already too much especially when I need to take care of my family first and I'm finding that more difficult each month. I can't afford to get more money taken out. There are some programs that working people pay into (unemployment and Social Security) in the hopes that if they ever need it it will be available for them to use. Its like a bank account or a retirement fund if you put money in to save for a rainy day and then all of a sudden the government comes along and says "you know what we need some of that to give to others" is that fair?
I'm a republican and I donate automatically to two charities each month that doesn't make me a Democrat. But I get to choose who and how much.
The government is to free with our money. You talk about rich most of them are millionaires and will never be affected by their policies.
and forget about school's they get way too much money, How did we learn and our parents learn? Was our education so bad? This country spends so much on education and are we the best??
Message edited 10/26/2008 7:37:37 AM.
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| Posted 10/26/08 7:37 AM |
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juanvi
Get Out!
Member since 10/06 4463 total posts
Name:
Christina
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
I guess this is the type of thing that makes me a true democrat. I feel that if I pay into something like that, whether I need it or not, I know it'll go to somone that does need it. Someone like my grandmother that needed it at one point in her life. There are those that abuse the system, yes, so report them and move on. Most people on unemployment need it.
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| Posted 10/26/08 8:34 AM |
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KateDevine
*
Member since 6/06 24950 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by juanvi
I guess this is the type of thing that makes me a true democrat. I feel that if I pay into something like that, whether I need it or not, I know it'll go to somone that does need it. Someone like my grandmother that needed it at one point in her life. There are those that abuse the system, yes, so report them and move on. Most people on unemployment need it.
THANK YOU
I am about to start collecting unemployment again next week, I guess I am lazy b/c I need it to feed my family and pay my bills.
I find it highly insulting that people compared unemployment to someone bilking the system. I've paid into it for many years, and now I need it. It happens to everyone in life.
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| Posted 10/26/08 8:50 AM |
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mrsej
The cutest!
Member since 1/07 2495 total posts
Name:
Mommy
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
I don't think republicans have a problem with giving support to people in need. In fact, Republicans give more to charity than Democrats and conservatives contribute 30% more than liberals. I think that Republicans (I am totally generalizing, of course!) tend to be economically conservative and when they see hard earned money wasted in programs that don't really work (and I am not specifically talking about unemployment, etc), it irritates people.
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| Posted 10/26/08 9:09 AM |
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Deedlebugs
Blessed
Member since 12/05 10281 total posts
Name:
Kiki
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
This is what most of the McCain supporters were saying. That is the difference between the two. You are NOT lazy and need help from something you contributed too. We agree with that. The OP was questioning why we feel unemployment is OK and not "spreading the wealth" The PP were defending unemployment.
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| Posted 10/26/08 9:12 AM |
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mrsej
The cutest!
Member since 1/07 2495 total posts
Name:
Mommy
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by Deedlebug126
This is what most of the McCain supporters were saying. That is the difference between the two. You are NOT lazy and need help from something you contributed too. We agree with that. The OP was questioning why we feel unemployment is OK and not "spreading the wealth" The PP were defending unemployment.
ITA - I think there is a huge difference between someone collecting unemployment b/c they just lost their job (what unemployment was made for) and someone having another baby so she can still collect welfare. Big difference.
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| Posted 10/26/08 9:15 AM |
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stickydust
Now a mommy of 2!!!
Member since 4/06 3164 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by smdl
Posted by LittleBlueBug
Not trying to stir the pot, but was anyone UNaware that we had some social programs?
It was a REMINDER that we do pay taxes and contribute for programs ALREADY in place that spread the wealth to needy people ALREADY!
Did I say ALREADY enough times tonight?
Whether we pay more of less taxes, we do spread the weath ALREADY regardless of the President.
I agree and I think everyone recognizes this. The problem, in my opinion, is that the current social programs we have in place have been so poorly managed, that to me, before we start pumping more tax dollars into it - this needs a complete overhaul. These programs have been failing for a while (not just under the republican administration). SO my problem with "spreading the wealth" is that it is ineffective and not really a solution. Instead of giving "tax credits" to people that do not pay any income taxes - I think that money would be better utilized by putting programs in place that would actually help these people succeed in the future.
So, as a republican, it is not that I am against social programs - I am just against taking money from one group - giving it to another group and not profoundly thinking about how to really help that group.
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| Posted 10/26/08 10:08 AM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
I don't think that we have to be on one extreme end of the spectrum or the other. That's what communists and fascists are. I think it's perfectly acceptable to be a Republican (I am not) and be in favor of some more "socialist" programs like unemployment and social security. Just like I think it is fine to be a Democrat (I am not) and be in favor of fiscal responsibility or state's rights.
the spectrum's all about about shades of gray...makes me think of wow wow wubbzy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uZnVuL9k8Y
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| Posted 10/26/08 10:14 AM |
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snowflake08
Love my boys!!!
Member since 8/07 5148 total posts
Name:
Laura
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
On the news the other day, they were showing a mock election in a NJ elementary school. They interviewed a 5th grade girl and she said "The democrats want to give fish to the hungry people and the Republicans want to give them a fishing pole"
chinese proverb: give a man a fish, he eats for the day. Teach a man how to fish, he eats for the rest of his life.
I agree with somoene on page 1 that said they think of it as insurance - Unemployment and welfare are 2 very different things
i think what a lot of people feel is that when people are GIVEN whatever they need, whether it be money, healthcare, food, etc. there is NO incentive to go and do for yourself
Unfortunately, I see it everyday.
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| Posted 10/26/08 10:17 AM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by evnme
i will restate what i said before: there is a difference between paying our taxes and being taxed to death!
Maybe that's what Ben Franklin meant?
In this world nothing is certain but death and taxes
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| Posted 10/26/08 10:27 AM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by snowflake08
On the news the other day, they were showing a mock election in a NJ elementary school. They interviewed a 5th grade girl and she said "The democrats want to give fish to the hungry people and the Republicans want to give them a fishing pole"
chinese proverb: give a man a fish, he eats for the day. Teach a man how to fish, he eats for the rest of his life.
I don't see the Dem/Rep connection like that. Social programs giving "handouts" are supposed to help people while they are learning to fish...and Dems are usually in favor of education programs as well...it's not strictly a Republican idea.
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| Posted 10/26/08 10:31 AM |
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nrthshgrl
It goes fast. Pay attention.
Member since 7/05 57538 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
I'm reading this thread & . While I don't know anyone on welfare and have never been on it, it seems like it's being assumed that people on welfare are lazy & don't want to work?
While I think there are people that abuse the system, I think it's safe to say there are families that wouldn't be eating if it wasn't for these social programs.
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| Posted 10/26/08 11:38 AM |
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SweetestOfPeas
J'taime Paris!
Member since 3/06 32345 total posts
Name:
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by smdl
I did not need 2 pages of people bashing Obama.
sorry but - who was bashing Obama on the first 2 pages?
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| Posted 10/26/08 11:42 AM |
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Candy Girl
Candy girl- you are so sweet!
Member since 11/07 6349 total posts
Name:
erin
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
I thought that companies paid unemployment insurance?
Isn't that why when a person applies for unemployment the powers that be contact the employer to verify that the person was terminated, laid off etc and didn't quit their job or wasn't fired for incompetence etc?
Anyway, I always thought of taxes as the gov't taking our money and redistributing it as they saw fit. I think one of Obama's biggest verbal mistakes was using the term "spread the wealth." It's gotten a lot of people mad and though I don't think he meant to, pit classes against each other.
Sigh.
Also, someone wrote earlier that welfare is long term while unemployment is short term. I disagree.
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:06 PM |
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snowflake08
Love my boys!!!
Member since 8/07 5148 total posts
Name:
Laura
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Re: Food for thoughts - For Republicans (but Democrats welcome!)
Posted by Erica
Posted by snowflake08
On the news the other day, they were showing a mock election in a NJ elementary school. They interviewed a 5th grade girl and she said "The democrats want to give fish to the hungry people and the Republicans want to give them a fishing pole"
chinese proverb: give a man a fish, he eats for the day. Teach a man how to fish, he eats for the rest of his life.
I don't see the Dem/Rep connection like that. Social programs giving "handouts" are supposed to help people while they are learning to fish...and Dems are usually in favor of education programs as well...it's not strictly a Republican idea.
while i know what they are "supposed" to do in theory, is not the actuality for MANY people; there definitely needs to be reform
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| Posted 10/26/08 12:08 PM |
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