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Deedlebugs
Blessed
Member since 12/05 10281 total posts
Name: Kiki
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Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
CNN
Washington (CNN) -- President Barack Obama on Thursday made official a long-held but rarely stated U.S. policy that a future Palestinian state should be based on borders that existed before the 1967 Middle East war. The contours for a two-state solution to the Israel-Palestinian conflict pushed by the United States have previously been based on the borders in place prior to the war 44 years ago in which Israel seized the West Bank, Gaza Strip, Golan Heights and Sinai Peninsula. However, Obama took U.S. endorsement of the policy a step further by expressing it so clearly in a major speech on the Middle East. "The United States believes that negotiations should result in two states, with permanent Palestinian borders with Israel, Jordan, and Egypt, and permanent Israeli borders with Palestine," Obama said in the concluding section of his 45-minute address that looked at political and social change sweeping across the Middle East and North Africa. "We believe the borders of Israel and Palestine should be based on the 1967 lines with mutually agreed swaps, so that secure and recognized borders are established for both states," Obama continued. His position agreed with the Palestinian negotiating stance on border issues in the staggering peace process, now stalled again by disputes over Israel settlements in the West Bank and the role of Hamas -- a terrorist group in the eyes of the United States and Israel -- in the Palestinian leadership. At the same time, Obama reiterated unwavering U.S. support for Israel's security, and he endorsed major negotiating positions of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's government, including an incremental handover of security responsibilities by Israel when conditions on the ground allow it. Obama declared the U.S. commitment to Israel's security "unshakable," and said "every state has the right to self-defense, and Israel must be able to defend itself -- by itself -- against any threat." "Provisions must also be robust enough to prevent a resurgence of terrorism; to stop the infiltration of weapons; and to provide effective border security," Obama continued, touching on the major concerns of Israel in facing a new Palestinian neighbor. "The full and phased withdrawal of Israeli military forces should be coordinated with the assumption of Palestinian security responsibility in a sovereign, non-militarized state. And the duration of this transition period must be agreed, and the effectiveness of security arrangements must be demonstrated." Tony Blair, the former British prime minister now working as part of international efforts to secure an Israeli-Palestinian peace agreement, said the security assurances and provisions are essential to the territorial issue. "I think it's saying in essence, that the Palestinians have got to be sure that their state is viable in terms of territory," Blair told CNN shortly after Obama spoke. "Obviously, there are going to be deviations or changes (from the exact 1967 borders) that are mutually agreeable." On the other hand, Blair said, Israel has the right to protect itself. As expected, initial reaction was mostly negative. A statement from Netanyahu's office rejected what it called a withdrawal to the 1967 borders, calling them "indefensible" and noting it would leave major Israeli population centers in Palestinian territory. Hamas also rejected the speech. Obama used his speech to speak directly to both Israel and Palestinians, declaring that both sides must yield on some deeply entrenched positions in order to bring peace that is desired and needed by both the region and the world. He criticized both sides for "unmet" expectations despite decades of efforts by U.S. administrations, including his own, to facilitate an agreement. In particular, Obama cited Israel's insistence on building new housing settlements on the West Bank and other areas beyond its 1967 borders. On Thursday, Israel announced the approval of projects to build 1,500 housing units in Har Homa and Pisgat Zeev, which are outside the 1967 borders. Roye Lackmanovich, an Interior Ministry spokesman, said the projects had previously received initial approval. "The status quo is unsustainable, and Israel too must act boldly to advance a lasting peace," Obama said, adding that "the dream of a Jewish and democratic state cannot be fulfilled with permanent occupation." Obama also rejected any Palestinian effort to challenge Israel's right to exist, saying they would "end in failure." He noted an expected push for a symbolic U.N. General Assembly resolution in September "won't create an independent state." While calling for positive steps by both sides on territory and security issues, Obama said he recognized two "wrenching and emotional issues" remain unresolved -- the future status of Jerusalem, which is claimed by both sides, and the fate of Palestinian refugees who claim Israel as their homeland. Obama also repeated the strong U.S. opposition to Hamas playing a leadership role unless it recognizes Israel's right to exist and renounces terrorism. "The recent announcement of an agreement between Fatah and Hamas raises profound and legitimate questions for Israel -- how can one negotiate with a party that has shown itself unwilling to recognize your right to exist," Obama said. "In the weeks and months to come, Palestinian leaders will have to provide a credible answer to that question." Netanyahu's statement cited the refugee and Hamas issues as major obstacles to renewed peace talks sought by Obama. "Without a solution to the Palestinian refugee problem outside the borders of Israel, no territorial concession will bring peace," said the statement, adding that Netanyahu -- who will meet with Obama on Friday in Washington -- "will also express his disappointment over the Palestinian Authority's decision to embrace Hamas, a terror organization committed to Israel's destruction." Obama acknowledged the "suspicion and hostility" that impeded the peace process, but added he was "convinced that the majority of Israelis and Palestinians would rather look to the future than be trapped in the past."
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Posted 5/19/11 4:54 PM |
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marymob
Member since 5/11 1368 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
I believe Ezekiel 37:21 about the return of the Jewish people to their homeland, and I believe in Ezekiel 37:26-27, that the Jewish people will dwell there forever. In Joshua 1:3-4, THE LORD speaks of the boundaries of Israel. Respectfully, I don't agree that they should give any land back. Mary
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Posted 5/19/11 5:28 PM |
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mrswask
Pookie Love
Member since 5/05 20229 total posts
Name: Michal
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
I'm sure my Aba (dad), who fought in the Six Day War in 1967 and Yom Kippur War in 1973 is FLIPPING right now along with my Saba (grandpa) who fought in the 1947 War for Independence - he's probably rolling in his grave!
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Posted 5/19/11 5:32 PM |
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Deedlebugs
Blessed
Member since 12/05 10281 total posts
Name: Kiki
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by marymob
I believe Ezekiel 37:21 about the return of the Jewish people to their homeland, and I believe in Ezekiel 37:26-27, that the Jewish people will dwell there forever. In Joshua 1:3-4, THE LORD speaks of the boundaries of Israel. Respectfully, I don't agree that they should give any land back. Mary
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Posted 5/19/11 5:32 PM |
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itkocak
Member since 7/07 7639 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Message edited 11/25/2011 9:07:34 AM.
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Posted 5/19/11 5:53 PM |
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annoyedTTCer
LIF Adult
Member since 4/09 3272 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by imthekevinofcindyandkevin
i think we (the us govt.) should stay the hell out of it.
I agree
And not a fan of saying land belongs to someone because the bible says so.
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Posted 5/19/11 5:55 PM |
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Summergrl73
LIF Adolescent
Member since 5/07 510 total posts
Name: Excited
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
The only reason that Israel has more land after 1967 is because the Arab countries surrounding it kept attacking them- Israel didnt start those wars and if the ones who started it lost..then oh well- you lose the war- you lose the land. Also, a lot of those countries will not be satisfied unless Israel ceases to exist so changing the borders will not make them stop fighting Israel.
And we really cant stay out of it- we have had a committment to help Israel since it was created
Message edited 5/19/2011 6:44:32 PM.
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Posted 5/19/11 6:43 PM |
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mommy2Alex
3 babies for me :)
Member since 5/05 6683 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
I think this is a slap in the face to Israel. I think the US needs to support Israel as they are our ally and they are the only true Democratic society in the Middle East.
I wonder how all of the Jewish people who voted for Obama feel about this?
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Posted 5/19/11 6:46 PM |
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kimmaymb20
a year of surprise
Member since 7/09 1119 total posts
Name: Kimberly
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by mommy2Alex
I think this is a slap in the face to Israel. I think the US needs to support Israel as they are our ally and they are the only true Democratic society in the Middle East.
I wonder how all of the Jewish people who voted for Obama feel about this?
they probably dont care which is sad ..... sorry Obama is WRONG and Im supporting Isreal on this.
edited to totally agree with you on this
Message edited 5/19/2011 7:36:59 PM.
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Posted 5/19/11 7:36 PM |
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mrswask
Pookie Love
Member since 5/05 20229 total posts
Name: Michal
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by mommy2Alex
I wonder how all of the Jewish people who voted for Obama feel about this?
As a Jew, an Israeli, and the daughter/granddaughter of veterans of those wars (see my above post,) I am sickened. I supported Obama and I am just disgusted.
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Posted 5/19/11 7:39 PM |
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casey31
Mommy of 3!
Member since 5/05 2967 total posts
Name: Mommy to two boys and a girl
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by mrswask
I'm sure my Aba (dad), who fought in the Six Day War in 1967 and Yom Kippur War in 1973 is FLIPPING right now along with my Saba (grandpa) who fought in the 1947 War for Independence - he's probably rolling in his grave!
My father who fought in 1956 and my grandfather who fought in the war for independence are feeling the same way. Obama MUST be voted out in 2012.
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Posted 5/19/11 8:01 PM |
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casey31
Mommy of 3!
Member since 5/05 2967 total posts
Name: Mommy to two boys and a girl
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by Summergrl73
The only reason that Israel has more land after 1967 is because the Arab countries surrounding it kept attacking them- Israel didnt start those wars and if the ones who started it lost..then oh well- you lose the war- you lose the land. Also, a lot of those countries will not be satisfied unless Israel ceases to exist so changing the borders will not make them stop fighting Israel.
And we really cant stay out of it- we have had a committment to help Israel since it was created
well said!
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Posted 5/19/11 8:02 PM |
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MrsA1012
love my little girl !
Member since 9/10 5777 total posts
Name: Me
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by Summergrl73
The only reason that Israel has more land after 1967 is because the Arab countries surrounding it kept attacking them- Israel didnt start those wars and if the ones who started it lost..then oh well- you lose the war- you lose the land. Also, a lot of those countries will not be satisfied unless Israel ceases to exist so changing the borders will not make them stop fighting Israel.
And we really cant stay out of it- we have had a committment to help Israel since it was created
ITA.
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Posted 5/19/11 8:17 PM |
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liadorbs
LIF Adult
Member since 11/10 1221 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by imthekevinofcindyandkevin
i think we (the us govt.) should stay the hell out of it.
Couldn't agree more!
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Posted 5/19/11 8:32 PM |
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LisaW
Time for me to FLY!
Member since 5/05 13199 total posts
Name: Did I ever tell you that I hate people?
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by mommy2Alex
I wonder how all of the Jewish people who voted for Obama feel about this?
Lost my vote for next election
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Posted 5/19/11 9:02 PM |
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Goldi0218
My miracles!
Member since 12/05 23902 total posts
Name: Leslie
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by kimmaymb20
Posted by mommy2Alex
I think this is a slap in the face to Israel. I think the US needs to support Israel as they are our ally and they are the only true Democratic society in the Middle East.
I wonder how all of the Jewish people who voted for Obama feel about this?
they probably dont care which is sad ..... sorry Obama is WRONG and Im supporting Isreal on this.
edited to totally agree with you on this
They care. Trust me. Waaaaay too much of a sweeping generalization.
Jew here.
His attitude towards Israel didn't get him my vote the first time and it sure as hell won't get it the second time but I will say this - the Jewish vote will not get him re-elected. Half the Jews in the world live in the US - about 6-7 million people. Assuming they are all citizens over the age of 18(which is obviously not the case, 6-7 million votes ain't gonna be the deciding factor.
But the millions of dollars in campaign contributions from exorbitantly wealthy Jews in the US (of which there are many) that he will not receive will hit him where it hurts. Good luck Barack. Good luck!
ETA: I'm throwing my name in - female Jew would get elected lickety split!
Message edited 5/19/2011 9:50:27 PM.
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Posted 5/19/11 9:47 PM |
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Shelly
She's 7!!!
Member since 8/05 14624 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Israel obtained that land after it was attcked and fought and won that land. While I am not a supporter of the settlements, it is not the US' place to tell Israel to give back land. Israel has learned the hard way that you don't get peace by giving up land.
Obama, you just lost my vote.
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Posted 5/19/11 9:50 PM |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name: me
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
nm
Message edited 5/19/2011 10:43:20 PM.
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Posted 5/19/11 10:28 PM |
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DiamondGirl
You are my I love you
Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
Name: DiamondMama
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Posted by Goldi0218
But the millions of dollars in campaign contributions from exorbitantly wealthy Jews in the US (of which there are many) that he will not receive will hit him where it hurts. Good luck Barack. Good luck!
This is EXACTLY what i thought when I heard this. It truly makes no sense for him politically and it going to hurt him a lot.
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Posted 5/19/11 10:53 PM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name: Beth
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
THIS was the primary reason I had hesitations for voting for Obama. Creating a Palestinian State will NOT relieve the tensions, because they will not be satisfied until Israel ceases to exist. if they cared so much for the land, they shouldn't have engaged in wars that they knew they could risk losing. This proposal will only serve to weaken Israel's borders and open it up to more vulnerability.
This saddens me beyond words
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Posted 5/19/11 11:09 PM |
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Goldi0218
My miracles!
Member since 12/05 23902 total posts
Name: Leslie
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
I pray with all of my heart that Americans base their votes on more than recent events. I hope that current Obama supporters realize how serious this is. Based on past events in history, this isn't the first time Jews and Israel got a big F-U from the US. My hopes for the B'nai Mitzvot of my children in Eretz Yisrael are diminished once again.
ETA
I can't wait to see how this thread plays out when President Obama supporters log on. I only wish I had a desk based job, a bigger cup of coffee and less of a carpal tunnel flare-up. I'm still cramping from scribing/scoring ELA and math tests.
Message edited 5/20/2011 7:46:47 AM.
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Posted 5/20/11 7:36 AM |
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pickles16
Real Estate Professional
Member since 11/07 17227 total posts
Name: Jen
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
ITA! I am so livid about this I really can't put it into a well written thought. My FIL fought in that war. My grandmother was in Aushwitz and they are both just astounded by this. I was never a supporter of Obama and to the poster that made the point of all the wealthy Jewish contributions, I really pray it does hurt him, bc I have so many friends that are die hard liberals and Jews and will still support him to the death!!!!!
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Posted 5/20/11 7:41 AM |
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Goldi0218
My miracles!
Member since 12/05 23902 total posts
Name: Leslie
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
If Jeremy did not have an important doctor's appointment this Saturday morning Shabbat services, I'd be sitting in my local shul saying Kaddish. I REALLY want to hear the Rabbi's sermon this week.
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Posted 5/20/11 7:54 AM |
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headoverheels
s'il vous plaît
Member since 6/07 42079 total posts
Name: LB
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
I won't comment on his statement, because I don't know enough about Israel or politics to do so, but I am curious: Does anyone know if there are any other countries who have been granted independence based almost solely on what the Bible says?
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Posted 5/20/11 8:00 AM |
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Leeners
:)
Member since 5/05 4898 total posts
Name: Eileen
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Re: Obama calls for Israel's return to pre-1967 borders
Not getting involved in this debate but wanted to make a point of clarification. He is not calling for the unilateral return to pre-1967 borders - it is the pre-1967 borders WITH land swaps to account for Israeli settlements in the West Bank, as a starting point.
Just want to be certain that as this debate rages on - here and IRL - that people pay attention to that bit because everything I'm seeing - here, in the media - only references the pre-1967 borders.
ETS: the 'in the media' piece meaning in their (somewhat inflammatory) headlines. It is only when you read through the full articles that even a mention of the land swaps is made.
Message edited 5/20/2011 8:23:12 AM.
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Posted 5/20/11 8:17 AM |
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