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Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
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MrsC614
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Gina
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by BunnyWife
Posted by MrsC614
Posted by MandJZ
I'll throw my hat in the ring for this one.
While I hear what people are saying regarding the usefulness of this procedure, it is not the government's place to determine that - it is between a doctor and a patient to decide which procedures are MEDICALLY necessary. Pregnant women choose procedures like amnios and other testing with advice and counsel from their doctors, not the government. This is an invasive medical procedure that the government is FORCING on women, for the sole purpose of shaming them, not because it is medically necessary for their health (OR the health of the unborn child). If an ultrasound is required, let the doctor decide. Old white men sitting in a building somewhere have no right to tell me or any other woman what medical procedures I MUST have. This coming at the same time as the proposal of bills allowing employers to opt out of providing birth control coverage in their benefits package is just too much. It is all, together, an attack on women's rights and IMO is threatening to send this country back decades.
1. an ulltrasound, whether abdominal or intravaginal is a NON INVASIVE procedure. an amnio is INVASIVE, and an abortion is INVASIVE. in my opinion, being a medical professional for 13 years, you SHOULD have an ultrasound to confirm intrauterine placement BEFORE some idiot doctor does a D N C without one, and lands you infertile because of it.
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I respectfully disagree. Having had many transvaginal ultra sounds because of a medical issue it sucks,it's invasive and can be painful if your someone like me who has a tilted uterus. You are sticking a probe up a women's vagina for no reason but to shame her into seeing this zygote as a person. It is not considered normal medical procedure to have this done before an abortion and I would bet money that it will be found unconstitutional.
it might FEEL invasive to you, but medically an technically, it is considered a NON INVASIVE procedure. yes, i understand they are uncomfortable, we all dislike them. but i doesn't make it invasive by medical standards because of that. but i understand what you mean.
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Posted 3/5/12 11:07 AM  |
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BunnyWife
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by MrsC614
Posted by VanderZwang
Posted by rmdrn125
Beautifully put. Personally, I am pro life, but I am pro choice for any other woman.There is a reason for Roe v. Wade, this ridiculous "stipulation" is going to bring us back to the back alley!! My whole concern is if the woman doesnt want the pregnancy, what kind of parent will she be? I completely iunderstand the notion of seeing your baby on ultrasound for the first time..it is the most awesome feeling ever, but i think that holds true because I was in love with that child the minute I knew I was pregnant, KWIM?
I am shocked that more people who are anti abortion dont get this!!!!!!!!!!
If I am not fit, ready, willing, able WHY should I be forced to have a child I dont want?
Crime will go up. Poverty will go up. Instance of Negleted children, beaten children, abused children, abandoned children, WILL go up.
Our taxes WILL go up because of the welfare mothers.
No one talks about how *WE* pay for all these unwanted children.
No one talks about how the unwanted children will pay.....
adoption is always an option, this is why i am pro life. there are millions of people who want to adopt. i know of couples who waiting years to adopt, and it was a torturous process. these are people who can't have kids themselves, and really want to. they would take that child in a second and provide a loving home.
Let's be honest. Making abortion illegal is not going to stop abortion. Middle class and rich women have ALWAYS been able to have safe abortions. It's poor women that will suffer. The amount of adoptions won't go up but the amount of women dying will.
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:08 AM |
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Atherley
So in Love with my DS
Member since 1/11 1122 total posts
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by itsbabytime
Honestly, I think its strange but, I don't see why so many people are appalled by it. Why shouldn't you have accountability for your actions? If there is nothing wrong with having an abortion then why should it be so horrific to have see what actually is being aborted?
I think the problem is that we all know the answer to this. Any mother knows that at their 12 wk sono their child LOOKED and ACTED like exactly that - a child. So I guess that is what is cruel about it? It's more humane to just let women "abort" the life in side of them without having to look at it? This law is exempting the innocent victims.
Maybe it will actually stop the use of abortion as birth control if women have to look at the face they are aborting. I don't see what's so wrong about making women accountable for their actions. And, further, this isn't a "procedure." It's a lot less invasive than an abortion I think. It's a sonogram. We all have them for one reason or another.
This
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:13 AM |
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MrsC614
My little angel is here <3
Member since 7/09 2851 total posts
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Gina
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by BunnyWife
Posted by MrsC614
Posted by VanderZwang
Posted by rmdrn125
Beautifully put. Personally, I am pro life, but I am pro choice for any other woman.There is a reason for Roe v. Wade, this ridiculous "stipulation" is going to bring us back to the back alley!! My whole concern is if the woman doesnt want the pregnancy, what kind of parent will she be? I completely iunderstand the notion of seeing your baby on ultrasound for the first time..it is the most awesome feeling ever, but i think that holds true because I was in love with that child the minute I knew I was pregnant, KWIM?
I am shocked that more people who are anti abortion dont get this!!!!!!!!!!
If I am not fit, ready, willing, able WHY should I be forced to have a child I dont want?
Crime will go up. Poverty will go up. Instance of Negleted children, beaten children, abused children, abandoned children, WILL go up.
Our taxes WILL go up because of the welfare mothers.
No one talks about how *WE* pay for all these unwanted children.
No one talks about how the unwanted children will pay.....
adoption is always an option, this is why i am pro life. there are millions of people who want to adopt. i know of couples who waiting years to adopt, and it was a torturous process. these are people who can't have kids themselves, and really want to. they would take that child in a second and provide a loving home.
Let's be honest. Making abortion illegal is not going to stop abortion. Middle class and rich women have ALWAYS been able to have safe abortions. It's poor women that will suffer. The amount of adoptions won't go up but the amount of women dying will.
not sure what that has to do with adoption. nor did i say that i think that rather than have people go through ultrasounds first, they should just ban abortion. i personally think that abortion is wrong, that is my opinion, just like you feel that it is morally acceptable, and that the baby inside really is not a life, or "just a zygote". AS far as poor women are concerned, they need to be educated to use protection, not just to protect themselves against pregnancy, but to also protect themselves against std's and hiv. shouldn't we be focusing more on that? preventing unwanted pregnancies, and therefor, reducing invasive procedures like abortion? sounds a whole lot easier to me.
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:14 AM |
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MrsC614
My little angel is here <3
Member since 7/09 2851 total posts
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Gina
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by NervousNell
Posted by VanderZwang
Posted by rmdrn125
Beautifully put. Personally, I am pro life, but I am pro choice for any other woman.There is a reason for Roe v. Wade, this ridiculous "stipulation" is going to bring us back to the back alley!! My whole concern is if the woman doesnt want the pregnancy, what kind of parent will she be? I completely iunderstand the notion of seeing your baby on ultrasound for the first time..it is the most awesome feeling ever, but i think that holds true because I was in love with that child the minute I knew I was pregnant, KWIM?
I am shocked that more people who are anti abortion dont get this!!!!!!!!!!
If I am not fit, ready, willing, able WHY should I be forced to have a child I dont want?
Crime will go up. Poverty will go up. Instance of Negleted children, beaten children, abused children, abandoned children, WILL go up.
Our taxes WILL go up because of the welfare mothers.
No one talks about how *WE* pay for all these unwanted children.
No one talks about how the unwanted children will pay.....
Ding ding ding.
Not to mention they want to cut coverage on BC.
So if not for abortion the only option will be abstinence or tons of unwanted children.
Seems like the country is taking steps backward.
It's scary.
i agree that cutting coverage for birth control is idiotic. while i may be pro life, i believe that people should be using whatever birth control is effective for them, and if the government wants to decrease abortions, they should be covering birth control and not viagra. however, i think the debate right now is with the catholic health system, who do not believe in birth control. i think an easy fix to this is to have goverment sponsered birth control coverage. if they are going to force women to have ultrasounds, then they should have an alternative, which would be providing birth control. it's probably less expensive than having the ultrasound performed honestly.
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:19 AM |
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Blu-ize
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Transvaginal ultrasounds are invasive.
I've had at least 70 of them over the past 3 years. Yeah I love them..can't wait.
Yes, I would like to adopt..no I can't have bio kids but it should never come down to a government mandate. Women's rights out the window.
Maybe women shouldn't vote.
Let's also impose sterlization as a punishment shall we?
Really, get out of my uterus and out of my decisions..
I'm all for educating people rich or poor and I don't think abortion should be used as contraception but the vast majority of women who opt for an abortion make a painstaking decision. There is no need to make it more painful by forcing them to look at the sono.
It comes down to punishment, guilt and shame.
Yes, that's what our country was built on.
Oh wait..isn't that religion?
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:24 AM |
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maybebaby
LIF Adult
Member since 11/05 6870 total posts
Name:
Maureen
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Something I don't understand..
Isn't getting an abortion an invasive procedure? More invasive than an internal ultrasound?
The reason most people are so enraged at this idea is because it is making women feel "worse" before what they are about to do...because its forcing them to see what they are terminating. Not because its somewhat invasive. Let's be real here...going to the gyno for a pap smear is invasive, many things related to going to the OB/GYN office is invasive. From my understanding, before abortions, an ultrasound is done...and in early pregnancy it is usually done internally. The real issue is that having a woman looking at the image is wrong.
I don't understand this mentality. Maybe because i see an image of a fetus with a beating heart as LIFE, and to me, abortion is a horrible thing. That is just how I feel. I am not saying i don't understand situations in why some women feel the need to have one...I do possess a large amount of sympathy and I've had friends who have had them...I don't agree but I keep my opinions to myself.
I just don't understand how this is so cruel to a woman. Maybe in SOME cases this opens a womans eyes to what she is doing-and maybe, seeing this life in front of them would make them reconsider. Not all women who have abortions do so because they would be horrible mothers and shoudln't have the child..outside pressures and honestly, like i posted earlier..the disconnect that many have to what they are doing...who knows. I am not quite sure how to feel about it BUT i don't think its the worst thing in the world. Women need to be educated in ALL areas of abortion-from the emotional and physical things that may be happening to them.
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:47 AM |
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GioiaMia
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Member since 1/07 14818 total posts
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by maybebaby
Something I don't understand..
Isn't getting an abortion an invasive procedure? More invasive than an internal ultrasound?
The reason most people are so enraged at this idea is because it is making women feel "worse" before what they are about to do...because its forcing them to see what they are terminating. Not because its somewhat invasive. Let's be real here...going to the gyno for a pap smear is invasive, many things related to going to the OB/GYN office is invasive. From my understanding, before abortions, an ultrasound is done...and in early pregnancy it is usually done internally. The real issue is that having a woman looking at the image is wrong.
I don't understand this mentality. Maybe because i see an image of a fetus with a beating heart as LIFE, and to me, abortion is a horrible thing. That is just how I feel. I am not saying i don't understand situations in why some women feel the need to have one...I do possess a large amount of sympathy and I've had friends who have had them...I don't agree but I keep my opinions to myself.
I just don't understand how this is so cruel to a woman. Maybe in SOME cases this opens a womans eyes to what she is doing-and maybe, seeing this life in front of them would make them reconsider. Not all women who have abortions do so because they would be horrible mothers and shoudln't have the child..outside pressures and honestly, like i posted earlier..the disconnect that many have to what they are doing...who knows. I am not quite sure how to feel about it BUT i don't think its the worst thing in the world. Women need to be educated in ALL areas of abortion-from the emotional and physical things that may be happening to them.
As I am proLife I understand what you are saying. . . HOWEVER, this is our GOVERNMENT. . .
It is basically legislation on how to make a woman feel guilty!
Do I think women who have abortions SHOULD look at ultrasounds? SHOULD realize they have a LIFE growing inside of them? ABSOLUTELY.
However, there is something about our government - making it a law to torture women in this way. Abortion is still legal, whether I agree with it or not. . . They have no right using cruel methods to try and discourage people from going through with something that is legal.
That is why it just does not sit well with me. . . at all.
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:55 AM |
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MrsA1012
love my little girl !
Member since 9/10 5777 total posts
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Me
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
I'm pro-life for myself. If possible, I think it should be the option of last resort for others.
That said, I believe it needs to remain legal and accessible. I don't like the intrusive nature of this law and don't like the government having a say in what procedures a women should receive. It has the flavor of "big brother", and it makes me very uncomfortable. If this is acceptable what might come next? Any medical procedure, invasive or not, should be decided on by a women and her doctor.
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| Posted 3/5/12 11:57 AM |
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NervousNell
Just another chapter in life..
Member since 11/09 54921 total posts
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..being a mommy and being a wife!
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
I also don't get how they can even enforce this.
So the Dr will be like- LOOK. LOOK at the screen.
If I look past it, look to the side, or glaze my eyes over- will he know?
It just seems ridiculous.
I feel like the govt should be worrying about MUCH bigger issues in this country these days.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:00 PM |
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VanderZwang
LIF Adolescent
Member since 2/11 740 total posts
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Gail
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by MrsC614
I am shocked that more people who are anti abortion dont get this!!!!!!!!!!
If I am not fit, ready, willing, able WHY should I be forced to have a child I dont want?
Crime will go up. Poverty will go up. Instance of Negleted children, beaten children, abused children, abandoned children, WILL go up.
Our taxes WILL go up because of the welfare mothers.
No one talks about how *WE* pay for all these unwanted children.
No one talks about how the unwanted children will pay.....
adoption is always an option, this is why i am pro life. there are millions of people who want to adopt. i know of couples who waiting years to adopt, and it was a torturous process. these are people who can't have kids themselves, and really want to. they would take that child in a second and provide a loving home.
That is a fair point. I dont disagree. Adoption is an option, and a good one.
But we are talkng about FORCING a woman to go through an unwanted pregnancy.
FORCING a woman to carry a baby she does NOT want.
For whatever her reason is.
And I am going to put this out on the table. There arent enough homes for the miniority chidren we alreay have. There are TOO many black/hispanic etc children in the system. By forcing minority women to have babies they dont want, there will be more minority chidren in the system, if hey are lucky.
I dont want to digress from the original post.
Message edited 3/5/2012 12:02:40 PM.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:00 PM |
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-Baby-Love-
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Member since 2/12 156 total posts
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by cncforever
I want the government to stay out of my bed, my uterus, and my vagina.
I want birth control as an option in pill form and any other device.
I never want them to mandate I get an Hpv vaccine either
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:04 PM |
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maybebaby
LIF Adult
Member since 11/05 6870 total posts
Name:
Maureen
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by GioiaMia
Posted by maybebaby
Something I don't understand..
Isn't getting an abortion an invasive procedure? More invasive than an internal ultrasound?
The reason most people are so enraged at this idea is because it is making women feel "worse" before what they are about to do...because its forcing them to see what they are terminating. Not because its somewhat invasive. Let's be real here...going to the gyno for a pap smear is invasive, many things related to going to the OB/GYN office is invasive. From my understanding, before abortions, an ultrasound is done...and in early pregnancy it is usually done internally. The real issue is that having a woman looking at the image is wrong.
I don't understand this mentality. Maybe because i see an image of a fetus with a beating heart as LIFE, and to me, abortion is a horrible thing. That is just how I feel. I am not saying i don't understand situations in why some women feel the need to have one...I do possess a large amount of sympathy and I've had friends who have had them...I don't agree but I keep my opinions to myself.
I just don't understand how this is so cruel to a woman. Maybe in SOME cases this opens a womans eyes to what she is doing-and maybe, seeing this life in front of them would make them reconsider. Not all women who have abortions do so because they would be horrible mothers and shoudln't have the child..outside pressures and honestly, like i posted earlier..the disconnect that many have to what they are doing...who knows. I am not quite sure how to feel about it BUT i don't think its the worst thing in the world. Women need to be educated in ALL areas of abortion-from the emotional and physical things that may be happening to them.
As I am proLife I understand what you are saying. . . HOWEVER, this is our GOVERNMENT. . .
It is basically legislation on how to make a woman feel guilty!
Do I think women who have abortions SHOULD look at ultrasounds? SHOULD realize they have a LIFE growing inside of them? ABSOLUTELY.
However, there is something about our government - making it a law to torture women in this way. Abortion is still legal, whether I agree with it or not. . . They have no right using cruel methods to try and discourage people from going through with something that is legal.
That is why it just does not sit well with me. . . at all.
See, i don't view it as torture. From my understanding it's having a woman look at the image on the ultrasound before the abortion is done. Is that really torturous?
I do understand what you are saying, and like i said earlier..I'm not quite sure how to feel about it.
My sisters friend had an abortion at 10 weeks. She chose to look at the screen. She was seriously really taken back when she saw a baby on the screen...two arms/legs and moving around. She went through with it anyway, she chose to have an abortion...but she said to my sister that she wished she didn't look because it made it more real and upsetting.
Which makes me feel EVEN MORE than women should know what they are doing....so many don't realize that its not this little clump of lifeless cells. This is a growing PERSON that is relying on its mother to protect it. That is how I feel, others disagree....but its just a very very sensitive subject for me.
I'm not saying I agree with the policy. But there needs to be something else done so that all women are completely aware (through a diagram, a video showing an ultrasound at various stages etc...) of what exactly it is they are doing.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:04 PM |
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MandJZ
Time for Baby #2!
Member since 8/10 4194 total posts
Name:
M
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by maybebaby
Something I don't understand..
Isn't getting an abortion an invasive procedure? More invasive than an internal ultrasound?
The reason most people are so enraged at this idea is because it is making women feel "worse" before what they are about to do...because its forcing them to see what they are terminating. Not because its somewhat invasive. Let's be real here...going to the gyno for a pap smear is invasive, many things related to going to the OB/GYN office is invasive. From my understanding, before abortions, an ultrasound is done...and in early pregnancy it is usually done internally. The real issue is that having a woman looking at the image is wrong.
I don't understand this mentality. Maybe because i see an image of a fetus with a beating heart as LIFE, and to me, abortion is a horrible thing. That is just how I feel. I am not saying i don't understand situations in why some women feel the need to have one...I do possess a large amount of sympathy and I've had friends who have had them...I don't agree but I keep my opinions to myself.
I just don't understand how this is so cruel to a woman. Maybe in SOME cases this opens a womans eyes to what she is doing-and maybe, seeing this life in front of them would make them reconsider. Not all women who have abortions do so because they would be horrible mothers and shoudln't have the child..outside pressures and honestly, like i posted earlier..the disconnect that many have to what they are doing...who knows. I am not quite sure how to feel about it BUT i don't think its the worst thing in the world. Women need to be educated in ALL areas of abortion-from the emotional and physical things that may be happening to them.
I get what you're saying, I do. I am one of those who is very vocally against this, and I will try to elaborate as to why further.
I do think it is cruel and partially meant to 'shame' women. And yes, getting an abortion is invasive, I do not disagree - more so than an ultrasound? Absolutely. However, the main issue I have with this, and one I have heard many times, is not that it is cruel to women. It is that it is LEGISLATING women's healthcare. Pap smears are invasive, but they are a CHOICE. Yes, most of us get them because we know we need to for our overall health. But it is STILL a CHOICE. I do not feel that the government has any right (especially in a country where abortions are LEGAL) to tell me I must have a certain medical procedure, and what I must do with the results of that procedure. That is between ME and MY DOCTOR, NOT the government. And more than it being cruel or anything like that, that is my problem with this. And it's a big problem.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:08 PM |
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maybebaby
LIF Adult
Member since 11/05 6870 total posts
Name:
Maureen
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by NervousNell
I also don't get how they can even enforce this.
So the Dr will be like- LOOK. LOOK at the screen.
If I look past it, look to the side, or glaze my eyes over- will he know?
It just seems ridiculous.
I feel like the govt should be worrying about MUCH bigger issues in this country these days.
I really don't get how it would be enforced either...no one can turn your head and force you to look at a screen...
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:08 PM |
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
I consider myself pro-life, although I believe in free will and being able to make your own choices about your body.
I think that forcing a woman to "look" is unconstitutional and absurd. If it were a men's issue we wouldn't even be discussing this. Who's going to force the "fathers" to look? That's what I want to know.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:08 PM |
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NervousNell
Just another chapter in life..
Member since 11/09 54921 total posts
Name:
..being a mommy and being a wife!
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by greenybeans
Who's going to force the "fathers" to look? That's what I want to know.
Excellent point!
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:16 PM |
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maybebaby
LIF Adult
Member since 11/05 6870 total posts
Name:
Maureen
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
I never get this argument. Men are not the ones who are born with the ability to carry a child...it's women who are given this ability. Maybe if from the beginning of time it were men who were the ones to have this responsibility it would be the same arguments. who knows.
Men DO have it easier than women, they don't have to worry about getting pregnant and all that goes along with it. However, men also have no rights when it comes to abortion. It's sad that a man who very badly wants to keep a baby he had a huge part in conceiving has no rights to it...but thats a whole other story.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:25 PM |
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LadyBug1209
Mommy to FOUR little men!
Member since 8/08 9655 total posts
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by Atherley
Posted by itsbabytime
Honestly, I think its strange but, I don't see why so many people are appalled by it. Why shouldn't you have accountability for your actions? If there is nothing wrong with having an abortion then why should it be so horrific to have see what actually is being aborted?
I think the problem is that we all know the answer to this. Any mother knows that at their 12 wk sono their child LOOKED and ACTED like exactly that - a child. So I guess that is what is cruel about it? It's more humane to just let women "abort" the life in side of them without having to look at it? This law is exempting the innocent victims.
Maybe it will actually stop the use of abortion as birth control if women have to look at the face they are aborting. I don't see what's so wrong about making women accountable for their actions. And, further, this isn't a "procedure." It's a lot less invasive than an abortion I think. It's a sonogram. We all have them for one reason or another.
This
ITA!
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:31 PM |
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MandJZ
Time for Baby #2!
Member since 8/10 4194 total posts
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M
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by itsbabytime
Honestly, I think its strange but, I don't see why so many people are appalled by it. Why shouldn't you have accountability for your actions? If there is nothing wrong with having an abortion then why should it be so horrific to have see what actually is being aborted?
I think the problem is that we all know the answer to this. Any mother knows that at their 12 wk sono their child LOOKED and ACTED like exactly that - a child. So I guess that is what is cruel about it? It's more humane to just let women "abort" the life in side of them without having to look at it? This law is exempting the innocent victims.
Maybe it will actually stop the use of abortion as birth control if women have to look at the face they are aborting. I don't see what's so wrong about making women accountable for their actions. And, further, this isn't a "procedure." It's a lot less invasive than an abortion I think. It's a sonogram. We all have them for one reason or another.
I'm appalled by it mostly because the government has no right to tell me what medical procedure/test/whatever I need to do or have done to me (save for immunizations or things that are for the sake of PUBLIC health). And we can debate the use of the term 'invasive' over and over, but if *I* feel invaded by it, it is invasive to ME, and therefore should be my CHOICE. Just like now, as a woman who is not pregnant yet or seeking an abortion, if my doctor said "I recommend a transvaginal ultrasound because you may have xyz" it is MY choice if I have the ultrasound or not.
Message edited 3/5/2012 12:35:56 PM.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:35 PM |
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headoverheels
s'il vous plaît
Member since 6/07 42079 total posts
Name:
LB
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
I'm very pro-choice and I don't know if I agree with the law. On its surface, I really don't have a problem with it.
Yes, Viagra is easy for men to obtain, and it's harder for women to receive free birth control. That's a separate issue here, I think. ANYONE can abstain from sex if they really cannot ever afford to raise a child. One of the potential "consequences" (because I can't think of a better word) of having sex is conceiving a child. That applies whether you are in a relationship or not.
However I keep thinking about women/couples who choose not to have kids for whatever reason. I hate that this could possibly "guilt" them into keeping a baby just because they saw it on the screen - even if they gave it up for adoption, 9 months of pregnancy can be very hard on a woman's body.
I'm really torn over this. I get what the gov't is trying to accomplish here but I don't think they are considering ALL the potential parties who could be affected.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:42 PM |
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jilliibabii
Mrs. O'Connor
Member since 6/10 12821 total posts
Name:
Jillian
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by NervousNell
I also don't get how they can even enforce this.
So the Dr will be like- LOOK. LOOK at the screen.
If I look past it, look to the side, or glaze my eyes over- will he know?
It just seems ridiculous.
I feel like the govt should be worrying about MUCH bigger issues in this country these days.
That was my other thought. How can you FORCE someone to look? You can have the procedure done (I would imagine they'd do this anyway, no?) but you can't force the lesson to sink in.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:43 PM |
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maybebaby
LIF Adult
Member since 11/05 6870 total posts
Name:
Maureen
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by itsbabytime
Honestly, I think its strange but, I don't see why so many people are appalled by it. Why shouldn't you have accountability for your actions? If there is nothing wrong with having an abortion then why should it be so horrific to have see what actually is being aborted?
I think the problem is that we all know the answer to this. Any mother knows that at their 12 wk sono their child LOOKED and ACTED like exactly that - a child. So I guess that is what is cruel about it? It's more humane to just let women "abort" the life in side of them without having to look at it? This law is exempting the innocent victims.
Maybe it will actually stop the use of abortion as birth control if women have to look at the face they are aborting. I don't see what's so wrong about making women accountable for their actions. And, further, this isn't a "procedure." It's a lot less invasive than an abortion I think. It's a sonogram. We all have them for one reason or another.
I'm appalled by it mostly because the government has no right to tell me what medical procedure/test/whatever I need to do or have done to me (save for immunizations or things that are for the sake of PUBLIC health). And we can debate the use of the term 'invasive' over and over, but if *I* feel invaded by it, it is invasive to ME, and therefore should be my CHOICE. Just like now, as a woman who is not pregnant yet or seeking an abortion, if my doctor said "I recommend a transvaginal ultrasound because you may have xyz" it is MY choice if I have the ultrasound or not.
I completely understand your feelings. I do.
I am just offering my own thoughts...I'm pretty pro-life and this subject is always sensitive to me. If someone views a fetus as a baby, its hard to rationalize abortion in the first place. At least in my mind. But i respect the different viewpoints..
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:47 PM |
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MandJZ
Time for Baby #2!
Member since 8/10 4194 total posts
Name:
M
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by maybebaby
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by itsbabytime
Honestly, I think its strange but, I don't see why so many people are appalled by it. Why shouldn't you have accountability for your actions? If there is nothing wrong with having an abortion then why should it be so horrific to have see what actually is being aborted?
I think the problem is that we all know the answer to this. Any mother knows that at their 12 wk sono their child LOOKED and ACTED like exactly that - a child. So I guess that is what is cruel about it? It's more humane to just let women "abort" the life in side of them without having to look at it? This law is exempting the innocent victims.
Maybe it will actually stop the use of abortion as birth control if women have to look at the face they are aborting. I don't see what's so wrong about making women accountable for their actions. And, further, this isn't a "procedure." It's a lot less invasive than an abortion I think. It's a sonogram. We all have them for one reason or another.
I'm appalled by it mostly because the government has no right to tell me what medical procedure/test/whatever I need to do or have done to me (save for immunizations or things that are for the sake of PUBLIC health). And we can debate the use of the term 'invasive' over and over, but if *I* feel invaded by it, it is invasive to ME, and therefore should be my CHOICE. Just like now, as a woman who is not pregnant yet or seeking an abortion, if my doctor said "I recommend a transvaginal ultrasound because you may have xyz" it is MY choice if I have the ultrasound or not.
I completely understand your feelings. I do.
I am just offering my own thoughts...I'm pretty pro-life and this subject is always sensitive to me. If someone views a fetus as a baby, its hard to rationalize abortion in the first place. At least in my mind. But i respect the different viewpoints..
While I can respect that, really, I am clearly very pro-choice. And, abortion IS legal. It is a sensitive subject for me on the other side of the issue as it is for you. It was decided years ago that, in this country, the government can not legislate what a woman does with her body. THIS is exactly THAT - the government legislating something a woman must do with/to her body.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:50 PM |
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Re: Pro-choice or pro-life, how do you feel about this
Posted by maybebaby
I never get this argument. Men are not the ones who are born with the ability to carry a child...it's women who are given this ability. Maybe if from the beginning of time it were men who were the ones to have this responsibility it would be the same arguments. who knows.
Men DO have it easier than women, they don't have to worry about getting pregnant and all that goes along with it. However, men also have no rights when it comes to abortion. It's sad that a man who very badly wants to keep a baby he had a huge part in conceiving has no rights to it...but thats a whole other story.
There are so many men who walk away from their children. Men who don't provide any type of support.
I'll bet if they made laws that forced men to do things, like be involved with their children, support the mother and child emotionally and physically, there would be a decrease in abortion as well.
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| Posted 3/5/12 12:52 PM |
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