Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Yes asking why is rude. I think if you don't know anyone who experienced IF, you don't know just how rude it is or how much pain you can cause. But as the pp said ignorance is no excuse.

I think it's normal to ask "do you have kids?" when you're playing catch-up with someone after highschool. I saw someone I knew on Facebook who is 40 & posted photos of mainly her dog & a little girl. Since she posted to me about my kids, I asked if she had any. Even then I was hesitant because there were only a few of the little girl & tons of the dogs. When she responded no, I commented on her adorable furbabies.

Realizing I'm not in your shoes (should I even be answering this post??) I think the best way to answer the why quesiton depends on who is asking & how you're feeling at the time. I would probably answer in a way that will illicit the least amount of questions & cause you the least amount of angst.

I'm going to go out on a limb & it's probably not really the case that they're thinking less of you or that you've done something wrong. I can't imagine anyone I know thinking less of someone for not having kids (unless they're throwing their judgements around about poor parenting, then it gets as touchy as bringing a dog with you to the supermarket).

I agree for those that have kids, life revolves around them for some time. And yes there are times my bad days are made less worse if I have a wonderful child. There are also those days I have a little maniacal SOB on my hands that thinks the world revolves around them...and that makes my bad day worse. I think of it along the lines of being married. Some days snuggling up to the man you love rules. Other days, you've wondered why a uterus means you have to iron shirts & he shouldn't.

That doesn't mean your life needs to revolve around kids if you don't want it to. We'll still invite you to our kids parties because we adore you. We'll invite you out for drinks because well..we need to get out! But if you feel like you need something to fill the gap of being childless, then find something else - whether it be volunteer work, a hobby, travel, etc. Make something else your passion - everyone needs a passion that is theirs. This is probably going to come out wrong but if someone had children & made them their only passion, I'd want to flee from them. That's the mom yelling "Go Jenny Penny! You can do it...Go Dolly" that I'm texting my friend about on the sidelines of a soccer game. Everyone needs something of their own. Let's face it, kids grow up & start their own lives. We're going to need something else in our lives when they've started theirs.

Spend time with the people that get you -whether it be childless or not. I wouldn't suggest vacationing with people with children because..well we suck. We need to end our night early unless we have a babysitter - and even then we need to get up early. Dealing with a child & a hangover isn't a good combination. But please, please, please...invite us to vacation WITHOUT the kids.

We went to JazzFest last year with a couple without kids. DH told me ahead of time that they were childless (not by choice) and to limit talking about kids. I felt like I was back in college, staying up till the wee hours, talking about bands, philosophy, etc. Not one conversation about potty training...lots of discussions over work. Best thing ever!

As I said I don't know that I should have responded & I haven't walked in anyone else's shoes. Just my observations.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

People need to realize that just because choices may not work for them - they can still work for others! Whenever someone doesn't agree with something I do or how I live my life I tell them that I like to live it under my terms and hey, it might not work for you... but it works for me!

Let them judge - they are going to do it anyway whether I try to avoid it or not or whether I care or not.

People's intolerance of our various differences can be so insensitive.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Message edited 3/6/2009 12:38:20 PM.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

I'm recently married (5 months) and I'm asked a lot when DH and I are going to have a baby. He is 42 and I'm 35 so we are not getting any younger and they tell me that but, I'm not even sure if I want a baby. All of my friends have children and I've witnessed first hand how it totally changes the parent into this wonderful accepting person and the bond is something everyone should experience BUT, I will not have a child in this economy. Our finances need to be in order and we need to be "ready" in ever sense of the word regardless of age.

So, instead of being honest with people by telling them I'm unsure about it. I say that we want to wait a year and enjoy our 1st year together, getting our finances in order, etc. But, they always have a way to get around it. It drives me crazy!!

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

I wish people would just learn to MYOB!!! It really is such a personal decision about children and it shouldn't matter why you don't have any...ppl just need to live and let live.

DH and I get the baby questions from his family like crazy. His dad says I am "denying him" a grandkid because we should have had a baby already -- heck he didn't understand why we didn't get pregnant before we were married! 2 yrs after our wedding, he's acting like we are the most evil people for not wanting a kid yet.

Eventually we will have one -- BUT -- for now I enjoy having wknds off to do whatever and just BE. You shouldn't have to explain yourself or feel like anyone needs an explanation.

We have friends who are childless, others who have toddlers & babies, while others that have teenagers and tweens -- and I'm glad our friends who have kids don't ever feel like they need to alienate us and only be friends with those people who have kids.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

I really don't care if people don't choose to have children...if anything its better for the environment (less stress on natural resources)...so more power to them.

We thought about this for awhile, but we decided to have a family, but honestly, I don't really care if another couple decides not to...its not affecting me

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

To be honest, I couldn't understand how a couple could choose to not have children until I had a child. I would never have said anything to indicate that, but I admit I couldn't understand....

Now that I have a child I realize the incredible sacrifice that having a child entails. I don't think I completely got it until I had a child. Now I think that couples who choose not to have kids understand how much it will change their lives and realize that it's not for them beforehand - which is great! I would never trade what I have but now I can completely understand the other side of the coin of wanting to do what you want, when you want to and not have to worry about a person that is completely dependent on you.

There are so many rich and rewarding ways to spend your life other than being a parent. I don't think it's insensitive to ask if you have children but to ask why not, well that is rude.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Thispost just reminded me of something.

After I had a m/c 2 years ago and had been struggling with IF for awhile, DH and I hung out mostly with people who were a little older and the two women I was closest to and most comfortable with were pregnant (at the same time) and therefore had children a couple months apart.

They knew I had a m/c and was having alot of trouble and how I wanted a baby more than anything. But everytime we were at a party or a small group outing, all I heard about was onesies and carseats and baby monitors. I began to dread hanging out with these people and actually began to resent them because they didn't bother to limit their baby talk at all and I couldn't be included in any conversations. I just had to sit there and stare in a daze because I had nothing to contribute.

It made me feel completely left out and I hated it. I couldn't blame them because it was what was happening in their lives and they were excited. But I still will never forget that and thinkit was incredibly rude to behave like that as an adult.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

this is one of those "open mouth, insert foot" conversations.

How many times have people (not thinking what they're saying at all) say to couples "you gotta have a baby!!! You'll change your mind"

Sure, there are many couples who don't want children who are constantly harassed.... (If I were in that boat, I'd probably break down and quip something rather rude as a retort after a few years. My sympathy goes to those couples for enduring people's prepetual stupidity.) But much much worse, IMO, is when this is told to a couple who desperately wants a child, but is quitely enduring the hardships of infertility. You never know who is in the former group, and who is in the latter...

I view the 'do you want children' conversation as being very similar to the 'are you pregnant' conversation. I wouldn't ask if a woman is pregnant until I see a baby emerging from her body

I never ever go there.....

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Posted by JennyPenny

Thispost just reminded me of something.

After I had a m/c 2 years ago and had been struggling with IF for awhile, DH and I hung out mostly with people who were a little older and the two women I was closest to and most comfortable with were pregnant (at the same time) and therefore had children a couple months apart.

They knew I had a m/c and was having alot of trouble and how I wanted a baby more than anything. But everytime we were at a party or a small group outing, all I heard about was onesies and carseats and baby monitors. I began to dread hanging out with these people and actually began to resent them because they didn't bother to limit their baby talk at all and I couldn't be included in any conversations. I just had to sit there and stare in a daze because I had nothing to contribute.

It made me feel completely left out and I hated it. I couldn't blame them because it was what was happening in their lives and they were excited. But I still will never forget that and thinkit was incredibly rude to behave like that as an adult.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Lisa,

I've been wondering a lot of the same things since my last failure. I mean for sure this might be my life going forward so I'm glad you started this thread. I actually would love to see a separate board for living childless, whether it is living childless for now or forever.
Of course there is no doubt that being childless not by choice is completely different than choosing not to have kids. It just isn't the same at all.
I feel left out all the time. Everyone in our lives has kids. I'm trying to figure out what I will do with the rest of my life if I never have kids...I know that it will be important to have hobbies/interests/something that makes me keep going. I'm not done trying but I'm not sure when or if this will happen so I need to start having a life. As for bday parties, showers, etc...I'm sick of putting myself through that. I'm just not going to anything I don't feel like going to anymore.
I have such a good husband and we have sooo much love for each other. If our fate is to be childless then at least I know that we have each other and I'm very grateful for that.
*I'm not sure if this helped or if I'm just rambling but again, this has been on my mind lately and it feels good to get it out.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Posted by LisaW


I don't expect people to limit their child talk, and don't find it rude when they do...like you said its their lives...but, it does put us in a strange situation, especially when we are invited to birthdays and christenings, and other things just revolving around children.

DH HATES going to these things b/c he just feels so unconnected (and I guess b/c we are childless b/c of IF there is the whole emotional aspect of it), and I feel a sense of having to go for fear of offending anyone or just b/c its a natural part of life and if I don't go I am going drift away from my friends. I am lucky enough that I do have a group of "IF friends" (for lack of a better term ) who have children and are incredible and sensitive in these situations, and I wish everyone could be like them...

But yeah, when we do go...most of the time we are just sitting there listening to everyone talk about things we will never experience and know nothing about and its very hard...but again, that is b/c of why we are childless...and hopefully in time that pain will ease....

I'm curious how people who are childless by choice feel in these situations...do you find these events enjoyable?

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

I completely agree that the decision to have a child is the decision of the couple and everyone else should butt out.

DH and I want children. Our jobs pay nothing and we have a lot of credit card debt so we are not ready. I know you "never have enough money" but at the moment we really don't. I don't mind waiting until I'm 30 to start. Apparently that's not good enough for my dad's side of the family, who constantly ask and ask and ask and give their input. My cousin told me I shouldn't wait until I'm 30 because a lot of her friends waiting and had problems. To me that's kind of abrasive.

The only person I don't mind asking is my 8 and a half year old cousin. She really wants to baby-sit.

I usually discontinue the conversation. I answer with we're not ready and just shrug off persistant questioning.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

I think I would respect a person more for making the decision NOT to have children than to have children for the sake of expectations, if that makes any sense and it's not to be taken wrong.

The thing is this. Having children or even ONE child is an utterly massive responsibility and life altering experience. And it's truly a luck of the draw situation. While I know, without a doubt, that it is certainly the most amazing experience, I also know you can't go back. Having children is a forever commitment and for someone to acknowledge that they might not want to take that on, well, I applaud them for it and respect them. ANYONE can have a kid...I think having a child is a completely different thing than RAISING a child. Just like the difference between a wedding and marriage.

For my own life...we're going on 5 years of marriage and no kids. I think people are stunned!

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

Until I had DS I thought NOTHING would change with my friends, but it did. I will admit to it. I have to bring DS with me most times. I can have a good time with a friend and think nothing of it to have DS with me but I realize they may feel differently. I THOUGHT I could just pack DS and go whenever. Yes, that was good for a short time. I guess I could have done that when DS was an infant but honestly I was too exhausted from sleep deprivation and BFing was sucking the life out of me. Now he is a toddler and unless you have or had a toddler, you just don't know. I can talk to my friend during a lunch but my eyes are on DS and what kind of monkey move he is going to make. So I guess I am not 100% there. But what can I do? Yes, I can go out once in a while without my kid but it's a whole adventure. I already enrolled in the gym. DH has to watch the kid 2 nights. I work on weekends and DH watches DS on those 2 days. That leaves very little time for friends.

So yes, I "lost" some friends from the time I got PG to the time I got DS. I think about it and what happened but I guess it's hard for them to relate too. I am not "as free" as I used to. I really have obligations with DS. It's not like I can postponne laundry night. The kid needs to be fed and go to bed by a certain time. Or MY life will be a nightmare. I do try to give myself time for me but honestly it's hard.

So you go and hang with other moms who have kids similar in age. It's easier!!! My party nights are replaced by playdates. I just find that other parents with kids won't care that I multitask during a conversation. They know how it works.

Now, for the part that people ask you "when are you having kids?". BTDT with my Ex. Married many years with Ex prior to DH and no kids. I wanted them, he did not. It was VERY painful and it was really reopening the wound for me. Constently being reminded that I did not have kids, that I was getting older. Like I did not know! I feel it's natural to ask someone if they want children. But I just don't ask anymore. I realize it's not appropriate to ask such question.

I see nothing wrong with a couple not having kids. As long as it works for them. Based on those principle, what makes a question like "when are you having kid?" OK. We know what's next. "Oh, you don't want other kids. Only 1. Because you know it's coming up. It's apparently selfish to be a childless couple but that just as bad if you only want 1 kid. Then you are a selfish parent DEPRIVING your child from a sibling.

I think people should worry about their own happiness.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

This is a great question.
For now, we are childless by choice. We like having our freedom & not having to worry about taking care of anyone but ourselves.
Will we decide in the future to have children, it's possible... but maybe not... also it may not be that easy for us due to health issues anyway. We're on the fence & taking a "wait & see where life takes us in the next several years" approach.
Right now we're young (in our 20's) and married under 2 years, so we don't get the question about kids too often (although some of my coworkers ask, and I have one annoying friend who asks all the time).
But as the years pass & we're married longer & getting older, I'm dreading the questions, because I know our family & friends will have expectations. But F them!!! It's such a rude & personal question & nobody's business but ours! Ugh!!! I don't know what the best way to handle it is... if it's someone close, I'll try to be nice about it... if it's a stranger or someone I don't care for... I'll give a rude answer right back to them.

Re: Childless by Choice...or Not

I had always never wanted children. Then I got pg, then I mc.

Now, I am just undecided what to do. I was starting to feel something was wrong with me b/c I didn't want children. I am relieved to see there are others out there who don't want children.