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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
I'm going to add my 2 cents here... DH and I make over $250k so we will be impacted by Obama' proposed tax plan, and I don't, at all, have any resentment against this, or think it unfairly targets people who worked hard for their achievements.
I look at it this way - we enjoyed some nice tax cuts and rebates during the Bush administration, and where did that get us? A seriously faltering economy that will affect each and every one of us, the poor, the middle class and the rich.
If paying a few extra thousand in taxes means that we will have a better, future economic outlook for this country, then I'm all for it, because that makes a direct impact on MY future economic stability, and that of my children.
If we are all left to hoard our money and have no obligation to contribute to a greater good, what I think many miss is that this places us ALL at a greater risk.
Message edited 10/16/2008 7:12:51 AM.
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Posted 10/16/08 7:12 AM  |
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sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by Bxgell2
I'm going to add my 2 cents here... DH and I make over $250k so we will be impacted by Obama' proposed tax plan, and I don't, at all, have any resentment against this, or think it unfairly targets people who worked hard for their achievements.
I look at it this way - we enjoyed some nice tax cuts and rebates during the Bush administration, and where did that get us? A seriously faltering economy that will affect each and every one of us, the poor, the middle class and the rich.
If paying a few extra thousand in taxes means that we will have a better, future economic outlook for this country, then I'm all for it, because that makes a direct impact on MY future economic stability, and that of my children.
If we are all left to hoard our money and have no obligation to contribute to a greater good, what I think many miss is that this places us ALL at a greater risk.
We will be affected by Obama's proposed plan as well but I feel differently about it than you.
I would be willing to pay more if I believed it was for the greater good, but I don't.
I feel his plan is only enabling the irresponsible to continue their quest for a free ride & I believe that is the essence of our economic & social problems.
I'm tired of bailouts, I'm tired of people complaining the government didn't do enough for them, I'm tired of the sense of entitlement Americans have.
I cannot stand behind any plan that will foster the thought that the government controls our individual destiny & people should rely on some of us working harder so they don't have to work at all.
That is not for me & never will be.
FTR-I'm not republican or democrat
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:23 AM |
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passerby
LIF Zygote
Member since 8/08 47 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
I don't think anyone is hoarding money we all pay taxes, I just don't think that the person that works hard to get a good grades in high school, goes on to college and makes a career for himself that pays a little more, provides benefits and i'm sure is putting in more than 40 hours a week should be responsible for the person that maybe went out partying in high school and now is looking for somebody (the government) to help them out with entitlements.
Oh, I'm not defending myself, I don't make $250,000 a year, but i am raising my children to get good grades, get a good job and then enjoy life, not hand out their money to others.
I don't know the whole saying but this always reminds me of the saying
They came for the **** but I didn't care I wasn't ****, they came for the #### but I didn't care I wasn't ###, now they are coming for me and their is no one left.
Message edited 10/16/2008 7:29:33 AM.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:26 AM |
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GioiaMia
Let's Go Rangers!
Member since 1/07 14818 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by Bxgell2
I'm going to add my 2 cents here... DH and I make over $250k so we will be impacted by Obama' proposed tax plan, and I don't, at all, have any resentment against this, or think it unfairly targets people who worked hard for their achievements.
I look at it this way - we enjoyed some nice tax cuts and rebates during the Bush administration, and where did that get us? A seriously faltering economy that will affect each and every one of us, the poor, the middle class and the rich.
If paying a few extra thousand in taxes means that we will have a better, future economic outlook for this country, then I'm all for it, because that makes a direct impact on MY future economic stability, and that of my children.
If we are all left to hoard our money and have no obligation to contribute to a greater good, what I think many miss is that this places us ALL at a greater risk.
We will be affected by Obama's proposed plan as well but I feel differently about it than you.
I would be willing to pay more if I believed it was for the greater good, but I don't.
I feel his plan is only enabling the irresponsible to continue their quest for a free ride & I believe that is the essence of our economic & social problems.
I'm tired of bailouts, I'm tired of people complaining the government didn't do enough for them, I'm tired of the sense of entitlement Americans have.
I cannot stand behind any plan that will foster the thought that the government controls our individual destiny & people should rely on some of us working harder so they don't have to work at all.
That is not for me & never will be.
FTR-I'm not republican or democrat
Okay, I will add my opinion too.
DH and I do not and will NEVER make anywhere close to $250K.
I still think it is WRONG to tax those people MORE. They are getting taxed more as it is, but proportionally of course. . . but to raise JUST their taxes to me seems wrong. Yes, I do feel like it is a penalty for being rich and I don't think it is fair.
So, I think it is silly when people say that those against the plan are being "selfish" bc technically I could turn around and say: "doesnt affect me, tax those suckers!" but looking at the bigger picture I just dont think it is right.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:28 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by passerby
I don't think anyone is hoarding money we all pay taxes, I just don't think that the person that works hard to get a good grades in high school, goes on to college and makes a career for himself that pays a little more, provides benefits and i'm sure is putting in more than 40 hours a week should be responsible for the person that maybe went out partying in high school and now is looking for somebody (the government) to help them out with entitlements.
Maybe it's because I usually give the benefit of the doubt, but I hardly think that the majority of people who make under $250k are people who partied their arses off in high school and now look for those who worked hard to extend them help. I'd venture to say that's a huge misgeneralization and that most of the underprivileged in this country simply do not have the same opportunity that many of us were born into.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:31 AM |
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passerby
LIF Zygote
Member since 8/08 47 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Message edited 10/16/2008 7:35:45 AM.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:33 AM |
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VirginiaDeb
Don't eat me, hippo!
Member since 5/05 9252 total posts
Name:
Deb
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by passerby
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Ahh, the answer to everything.
Spend some time in public schools. Especially ones in poorer neighborhoods.
Then get back to me.
Everything isn't at cut and dry as it looks on the surface.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:36 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by VirginiaDeb
Posted by passerby
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Ahh, the answer to everything.
Spend some time in public schools. Especially ones in poorer neighborhoods.
Then get back to me.
Everything isn't at cut and dry as it looks on the surface.
AGREED. Most of the underprivileged grow up in broken homes, in poor, violent neighborhoods. And because of the way the schools are structured in this country, they are not provided the same kind of educational opportunities as compared to children who attend schools in other, more affluent neighborhoods. It doesn't matter how many scholarships you throw at them, if you don't provide them an equal opportunity to LEARN at an early age, they will never be able to take advantage of those things.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:38 AM |
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passerby
LIF Zygote
Member since 8/08 47 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
I worked in the city school (brooklyn). the learning was their for the taking.
My parents came over here uneducated and worked hard to make sure we worked hard to get an education.
and also that is welfare at its best parents are just looking for their benefits
Message edited 10/16/2008 7:41:38 AM.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:39 AM |
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sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by VirginiaDeb
Posted by passerby
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Ahh, the answer to everything.
Spend some time in public schools. Especially ones in poorer neighborhoods.
Then get back to me.
Everything isn't at cut and dry as it looks on the surface.
Senator Obama did pretty well against the odds
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:39 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by VirginiaDeb
Posted by passerby
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Ahh, the answer to everything.
Spend some time in public schools. Especially ones in poorer neighborhoods.
Then get back to me.
Everything isn't at cut and dry as it looks on the surface.
Senator Obama did pretty well against the odds
There are exceptions to every rule, but the truth of the matter is there is a growing dichotomy in this country, and I don't think it has ANYTHING to do with a laissez-faire attitude of entitlement.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:41 AM |
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sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by Bxgell2
Posted by VirginiaDeb
Posted by passerby
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Ahh, the answer to everything.
Spend some time in public schools. Especially ones in poorer neighborhoods.
Then get back to me.
Everything isn't at cut and dry as it looks on the surface.
AGREED. Most of the underprivileged grow up in broken homes, in poor, violent neighborhoods. And because of the way the schools are structured in this country, they are not provided the same kind of educational opportunities as compared to children who attend schools in other, more affluent neighborhoods. It doesn't matter how many scholarships you throw at them, if you don't provide them an equal opportunity to LEARN at an early age, they will never be able to take advantage of those things.
If we keep throwing money into "the system' they have been in for generations NOTHING will CHANGE.
Isn't that what we all want? CHANGE?
Breaking a terrible cycle might mean some tough love, as the mother of a 21 year old underacheiver I can speak from experience. More government funded handouts is the last thing this country needs to get back to a place of dignity & personal accountability & SUCCESS!!!
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:42 AM |
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ExpectingJoy
LIF Adolescent
Member since 5/05 751 total posts
Name:
Cari
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by prncss
Posted by stinkysmom80
My DH has a small business, There are ways to get around showing a profit
You need a GOOD ACCOUNTANT!!!!!!
One of my best friends is an accountant and she said very rarely do small business show a profit, and if they did, they would not use her accounting firm the next year
Isn't that tax evasion?
Yeah, I was going to say that it bad character. DH and I make over 250K, but when we go to bed at night- we do so with a clear conscience. Honest to the dollar.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:45 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by Bxgell2
Posted by VirginiaDeb
Posted by passerby
Public education is free, and many under privileged people get nice scholarships to colleges.
Ahh, the answer to everything.
Spend some time in public schools. Especially ones in poorer neighborhoods.
Then get back to me.
Everything isn't at cut and dry as it looks on the surface.
AGREED. Most of the underprivileged grow up in broken homes, in poor, violent neighborhoods. And because of the way the schools are structured in this country, they are not provided the same kind of educational opportunities as compared to children who attend schools in other, more affluent neighborhoods. It doesn't matter how many scholarships you throw at them, if you don't provide them an equal opportunity to LEARN at an early age, they will never be able to take advantage of those things.
If we keep throwing money into "the system' they have been in for generations NOTHING will CHANGE.
Isn't that what we all want? CHANGE?
Breaking a terrible cycle might mean some tough love, as the mother of a 21 year old underacheiver I can speak from experience. More government funded handouts is the last thing this country needs to get back to a place of dignity & personal accountability & SUCCESS!!!
I really don't think this is the answer, or that the problem in this country is so simply broken down. I think this kind of thinking is assuming that the masses of people in this country who are barely making ends meet are suffering due to their own laziness. There's simply no way I could ever argue against that to change anyone's mind, but I personally don't believe that's the heart of the problem in this country. I think the issue boils down to serious, serious inequality that starts at a very early age, in our public schools - and unless we do something to rectify the issue where it begins, the dichotomy will grow larger and larger, and a tough love attitude, of removing federal aid, will only widen the gap, and create misery all around that impacts us ALL.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:45 AM |
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SweetestOfPeas
J'taime Paris!
Member since 3/06 32345 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by Bxgell2
I'm going to add my 2 cents here... DH and I make over $250k so we will be impacted by Obama' proposed tax plan, and I don't, at all, have any resentment against this, or think it unfairly targets people who worked hard for their achievements.
I look at it this way - we enjoyed some nice tax cuts and rebates during the Bush administration, and where did that get us? A seriously faltering economy that will affect each and every one of us, the poor, the middle class and the rich.
If paying a few extra thousand in taxes means that we will have a better, future economic outlook for this country, then I'm all for it, because that makes a direct impact on MY future economic stability, and that of my children.
If we are all left to hoard our money and have no obligation to contribute to a greater good, what I think many miss is that this places us ALL at a greater risk.
would you feel differently about it if he took your very hard earned money and increased welfare programs for people who work the system and have more kids so that they can get more money from the Gov't?
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:47 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by SweetestOfPeas
Posted by Bxgell2
I'm going to add my 2 cents here... DH and I make over $250k so we will be impacted by Obama' proposed tax plan, and I don't, at all, have any resentment against this, or think it unfairly targets people who worked hard for their achievements.
I look at it this way - we enjoyed some nice tax cuts and rebates during the Bush administration, and where did that get us? A seriously faltering economy that will affect each and every one of us, the poor, the middle class and the rich.
If paying a few extra thousand in taxes means that we will have a better, future economic outlook for this country, then I'm all for it, because that makes a direct impact on MY future economic stability, and that of my children.
If we are all left to hoard our money and have no obligation to contribute to a greater good, what I think many miss is that this places us ALL at a greater risk.
would you feel differently about it if he took your very hard earned money and increased welfare programs for people who work the system and have more kids so that they can get more money from the Gov't?
No. I know there will always be bad eggs who take advantage of the system, but that's not reason enough for me, to remove, or cut back on those systems. A much better alternative is better regulation of those welfare systems. I'm sorry, I know there are people who take advantage of the government, but I am not so jaded to believe that the majority of the people who use government welfare are doing so because they are lazy and feel entitled. And in fact, I personally know quite a few people on government welfare, and I would never, in a million years, characterize them as such.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:51 AM |
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ExpectingJoy
LIF Adolescent
Member since 5/05 751 total posts
Name:
Cari
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by Bxgell2
I'm going to add my 2 cents here... DH and I make over $250k so we will be impacted by Obama' proposed tax plan, and I don't, at all, have any resentment against this, or think it unfairly targets people who worked hard for their achievements.
I look at it this way - we enjoyed some nice tax cuts and rebates during the Bush administration, and where did that get us? A seriously faltering economy that will affect each and every one of us, the poor, the middle class and the rich.
If paying a few extra thousand in taxes means that we will have a better, future economic outlook for this country, then I'm all for it, because that makes a direct impact on MY future economic stability, and that of my children.
If we are all left to hoard our money and have no obligation to contribute to a greater good, what I think many miss is that this places us ALL at a greater risk.
I feel exactly like you do. One day I was walking out of Bergdorf Goodman I saw a homeless man holding a an empty cup for cash. I figured that in the future I won't have to hand out individual dollars into that cup. I will give it in lump sum to the government and have them fill the cups as they see fit.
My only nervousness is that, with the $$, I want the government to be fiscally responsible. I want them to balance the budget, get us out of debt. I don't want more irresponsible programs with this $$. Basically, I want the guy who is going to be putting it to good use. Not sure either of these two is the guy for that. IMO, the government needs an accountant as pres, lol!
eta: I think we need to look at it as charity. Makes me feel a little better.
Message edited 10/16/2008 7:58:36 AM.
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| Posted 10/16/08 7:56 AM |
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LittleBlueBug
Happy Mommy
Member since 9/06 4074 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
There are bad eggs and there are good eggs, personally I knew too many bad eggs that completely used and abused the system. Someone who is no longer in our lives used to take OTB jobs while collecting wellfare. She lived in a pretty nice neighborhood...better than where I live.
ETA: Please see my previous post regarding the increase in taxes for health insurance.
Message edited 10/16/2008 8:01:56 AM.
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:00 AM |
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MrsM-6-7-08
<3
Member since 8/06 4249 total posts
Name:
Nicole
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by ExpectingJoy
Posted by prncss
Posted by stinkysmom80
My DH has a small business, There are ways to get around showing a profit
You need a GOOD ACCOUNTANT!!!!!!
One of my best friends is an accountant and she said very rarely do small business show a profit, and if they did, they would not use her accounting firm the next year
Isn't that tax evasion?
Yeah, I was going to say that it bad character. DH and I make over 250K, but when we go to bed at night- we do so with a clear conscience. Honest to the dollar.
This is not tax evasion at all. Its not cheating the system.
It is what small businesses do, most times there are many expenses.
An example, a small company 10 employees, each making 50k including the owner. Its possible not to show a large profit. As long as you are drawing a salary and paying employees, health insurance, sales tax etc. and all your other expenses.
You just need to have a good accountant, that knows the laws and what you can claim, and is smart.
I can not stand when people make such horrible accusations such as tax evasion.
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:01 AM |
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LittleBlueBug
Happy Mommy
Member since 9/06 4074 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by stinkysmom80
Posted by ExpectingJoy
Posted by prncss
Posted by stinkysmom80
My DH has a small business, There are ways to get around showing a profit
You need a GOOD ACCOUNTANT!!!!!!
One of my best friends is an accountant and she said very rarely do small business show a profit, and if they did, they would not use her accounting firm the next year
Isn't that tax evasion?
Yeah, I was going to say that it bad character. DH and I make over 250K, but when we go to bed at night- we do so with a clear conscience. Honest to the dollar.
This is not tax evasion at all. Its not cheating the system.
It is what small businesses do, most times there are many expenses.
An example, a small company 10 employees, each making 50k including the owner. Its possible not to show a large profit. As long as you are drawing a salary and paying employees, health insurance, sales tax etc. and all your other expenses.
You just need to have a good accountant, that knows the laws and what you can claim, and is smart.
I can not stand when people make such horrible accusations such as tax evasion.
What you are talking about here is legit write-offs. The OP regarding this made it seem like hording unclaimed monies. Yes, every business needs a good accountant that knows tax laws and gets the best deductions for their client...all individuals do to.
On that note...got to go to work
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:04 AM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by passerby
My parents came over here uneducated and worked hard to make sure we worked hard to get an education.
So did my grandparents - they came to this country to escape discrimination as jews in europe during WW2, without even a penny. And you better believe that my grandparents and parents were able to better themselves through government programs and anti-discrimination laws. My parents, and I am a direct product of people USING those programs for good...
Message edited 10/16/2008 8:07:31 AM.
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:04 AM |
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ExpectingJoy
LIF Adolescent
Member since 5/05 751 total posts
Name:
Cari
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by stinkysmom80
Posted by ExpectingJoy
Posted by prncss
Posted by stinkysmom80
My DH has a small business, There are ways to get around showing a profit
You need a GOOD ACCOUNTANT!!!!!!
One of my best friends is an accountant and she said very rarely do small business show a profit, and if they did, they would not use her accounting firm the next year
Isn't that tax evasion?
Yeah, I was going to say that it bad character. DH and I make over 250K, but when we go to bed at night- we do so with a clear conscience. Honest to the dollar.
This is not tax evasion at all. Its not cheating the system.
It is what small businesses do, most times there are many expenses.
An example, a small company 10 employees, each making 50k including the owner. Its possible not to show a large profit. As long as you are drawing a salary and paying employees, health insurance, sales tax etc. and all your other expenses.
You just need to have a good accountant, that knows the laws and what you can claim, and is smart.
I can not stand when people make such horrible accusations such as tax evasion.
I think the confusing part here are the words "getting around showing a profit". Why would one try to "get around" that? What is wrong with just being straightforward and putting the numbers out there? Just asking a question. The government believes companies stay in business with no profit?
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:06 AM |
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MrsM-6-7-08
<3
Member since 8/06 4249 total posts
Name:
Nicole
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by ExpectingJoy
Posted by stinkysmom80
Posted by ExpectingJoy
Posted by prncss
Posted by stinkysmom80
My DH has a small business, There are ways to get around showing a profit
You need a GOOD ACCOUNTANT!!!!!!
One of my best friends is an accountant and she said very rarely do small business show a profit, and if they did, they would not use her accounting firm the next year
Isn't that tax evasion?
Yeah, I was going to say that it bad character. DH and I make over 250K, but when we go to bed at night- we do so with a clear conscience. Honest to the dollar.
This is not tax evasion at all. Its not cheating the system.
It is what small businesses do, most times there are many expenses.
An example, a small company 10 employees, each making 50k including the owner. Its possible not to show a large profit. As long as you are drawing a salary and paying employees, health insurance, sales tax etc. and all your other expenses.
You just need to have a good accountant, that knows the laws and what you can claim, and is smart.
I can not stand when people make such horrible accusations such as tax evasion.
I think the confusing part here are the words "getting around showing a profit". Why would one try to "get around" that? What is wrong with just being straightforward and putting the numbers out there? Just asking a question. The government believes companies stay in business with no profit?
Actually yes, and im not talking about big companies like sony, or Nike, i am talking about small ones. its possible not to show a large profit.
All i am saying is what i was told, by a few accountants that i know that work with small businesses.
And now its like i am single handedly defrauding the govt.
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:13 AM |
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VickiC
Rocking the party
Member since 5/05 4937 total posts
Name:
Vicki
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by stinkysmom80
Actually yes, and im not talking about big companies like sony, or Nike, i am talking about small ones. its possible not to show a large profit.
All i am saying is what i was told, by a few accountants that i know that work with small businesses.
And now its like i am single handedly defrauding the govt.
All small companies need to show some sort of profit after 3 years I believe otherwise the gov't considers it a hobby and won't support the tax write offs anymore. Our accountant told us this as well since my husband is a musician and a "small business".
And no one is accusing you of defrauding the gov't. I think your OP was misconstrued is all.
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:53 AM |
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MeeshMosh
last month on leave!
Member since 6/08 4551 total posts
Name:
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Re: Debate '08
Posted by Blu-ize
And that passive/aggressive crap with McCain? Grow up..I can see that happening across the table with our allies when he disagrees on something.
i have NO idea who im voting for... i agree with both of them on different issues... but ITA with this statement... i was thinking the SAME exact thing when i was watching the debate last night and couldnt help put to get  over this thought!!
i just really dont know what i'm going to do!
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| Posted 10/16/08 8:58 AM |
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