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On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
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2PreciousBlessings
The Perfect Pair
Member since 5/06 19861 total posts
Name:
Best Wife & Mommy
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by 2PreciousBlessings
Reading this thread and my eyes are filled with tears about how heartless some posters can be. Sometimes people need to start thinking about each other a bit more. 
It's echoed in the political debates, too.
If I have a job it's because I'm AWESOME. If you don't it's because you're not working hard enough.
If you don't have health insurance, you should just die. Sucks to be you
So sad!
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Posted 10/18/11 3:24 PM  |
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HoneyBadger
YourWorstNightmare.
Member since 10/06 15979 total posts
Name:
BahBahBlackJeep
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by tarabelle99
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by Jennie0898
Oh so because you CHOOSE to not work it's ok?
I got news for you, I DO work and I DON'T have health insurance.
I work for a VERY small non-profit.
I'm debt FREE.
If something catastrophic befalls me health wise, I'm SCREWED.
BANKRUPTED.
Do you know how much it cost me to go to my OB/GYN for my annual and get a PAP smear? $1127. Now to me, that's BASIC healthcare - I paid it and SUCKED IT UP but rest assured I bet the cost has NEVER even crossed your mind.
I can only PRAY I don't get sick because GOD ONLY KNOWS how much something SERIOUS would cost.
It's so SAD that you would even think people aren't deserving of the same GREAT healthcare.
Who are YOU to put ANY sort of value on someone's life?
By your own admission you don't work. YOU don't contribute. I guess by YOUR logic YOU shouldn't have any healthcare since it's NOT YOUR SALARY paying for it.
Very sad.
Jennie this is YOUR fault, You CHOSE to work for a non-profit. You could have chosen to get a more profitable degree (no idea what your degree is in), and you could have chosen to work for a soul-sucking corporation to get benefits.
You just need to stop buying Starbucks and set aside the money to buy your own health insurance.
i'm bitter and resentful because I had to give up my dream to work for a big corporation to get health benefits and i do NOT want to pay your way.
I will NEVER give up my starbucks and I'm thoroughly insulted you would even suggest something as ludicrous as that!
Does that make me a system sucking addict? 
Yep. You're a societal drain and since you have no insurance, we can't send you to rehab for said addiction. I'm sorry. You'll have to find a new way to get your fix. Have you considered panhandling?
ETA: I bet you're good looking. How is your balance in lucite heels? Can you hang on a pole? Stripping could help you fund your habit............
Message edited 10/18/2011 3:23:41 PM.
I bet she has an iPad, too
I knew it. I'm a total drain on society. Although going for me is that I have AMAZING balance, though I don't own ANY lucite heels 
Perhaps, I could panhandle for the heels and THEN start stripping.
What kind of benefit plans do they offer at Scores?
Oh and sadly, no iPad for me...just an iPhone and iPod Touch 
I was able to purchase them with the money I'd have used to get health insurance.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:29 PM |
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stickydust
Now a mommy of 2!!!
Member since 4/06 3164 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Ophelia
sticky, you say there is bullying and peole make outrageous comments, and then insult everyone who made a point on this thread.
"I find discourse invigorating and this discourse has a lot of passion which is great but unfortunately, what appears to be a lack of substance on all sides. There seems to be a lack of comprehension on the most basic of tenets of economic theory."
ok awesome. no more personal attacks.
How is that an insult? I don't know a lot about medicine, for example. If someone pointed that out to me I would not be I insulted, it is not my expertise. I stand by what I said their is passion and name calling but not a lot of facts.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:32 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Can I just add that the person who wrote that giant sharpie note that started this post is going to be effed if she ever wants to buy a house?
She has no debt - no student loans?
And no credit cards- Therefore absolutely no credit credit history whatsoever.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:32 PM |
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tara73
carseat nerd
Member since 11/09 3669 total posts
Name:
Buttercup
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by tarabelle99
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by JenniferEver
Jennie this is YOUR fault, You CHOSE to work for a non-profit. You could have chosen to get a more profitable degree (no idea what your degree is in), and you could have chosen to work for a soul-sucking corporation to get benefits.
You just need to stop buying Starbucks and set aside the money to buy your own health insurance.
i'm bitter and resentful because I had to give up my dream to work for a big corporation to get health benefits and i do NOT want to pay your way.
I will NEVER give up my starbucks and I'm thoroughly insulted you would even suggest something as ludicrous as that!
Does that make me a system sucking addict?
Yep. You're a societal drain and since you have no insurance, we can't send you to rehab for said addiction. I'm sorry. You'll have to find a new way to get your fix. Have you considered panhandling?
ETA: I bet you're good looking. How is your balance in lucite heels? Can you hang on a pole? Stripping could help you fund your habit............
Message edited 10/18/2011 3:23:41 PM.
I bet she has an iPad, too
I knew it. I'm a total drain on society. Although going for me is that I have AMAZING balance, though I don't own ANY lucite heels
Perhaps, I could panhandle for the heels and THEN start stripping.
What kind of benefit plans do they offer at Scores?
Oh and sadly, no iPad for me...just an iPhone and iPod Touch
I was able to purchase them with the money I'd have used to get health insurance.
Can you take out a student loan to cover the heels, outfits and lessons?
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:32 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by tarabelle99
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by Jennie0898
Oh so because you CHOOSE to not work it's ok?
I got news for you, I DO work and I DON'T have health insurance.
I work for a VERY small non-profit.
I'm debt FREE.
If something catastrophic befalls me health wise, I'm SCREWED.
BANKRUPTED.
Do you know how much it cost me to go to my OB/GYN for my annual and get a PAP smear? $1127. Now to me, that's BASIC healthcare - I paid it and SUCKED IT UP but rest assured I bet the cost has NEVER even crossed your mind.
I can only PRAY I don't get sick because GOD ONLY KNOWS how much something SERIOUS would cost.
It's so SAD that you would even think people aren't deserving of the same GREAT healthcare.
Who are YOU to put ANY sort of value on someone's life?
By your own admission you don't work. YOU don't contribute. I guess by YOUR logic YOU shouldn't have any healthcare since it's NOT YOUR SALARY paying for it.
Very sad.
Jennie this is YOUR fault, You CHOSE to work for a non-profit. You could have chosen to get a more profitable degree (no idea what your degree is in), and you could have chosen to work for a soul-sucking corporation to get benefits.
You just need to stop buying Starbucks and set aside the money to buy your own health insurance.
i'm bitter and resentful because I had to give up my dream to work for a big corporation to get health benefits and i do NOT want to pay your way.
I will NEVER give up my starbucks and I'm thoroughly insulted you would even suggest something as ludicrous as that!
Does that make me a system sucking addict?
Yep. You're a societal drain and since you have no insurance, we can't send you to rehab for said addiction. I'm sorry. You'll have to find a new way to get your fix. Have you considered panhandling?
ETA: I bet you're good looking. How is your balance in lucite heels? Can you hang on a pole? Stripping could help you fund your habit............
Message edited 10/18/2011 3:23:41 PM.
I bet she has an iPad, too
I knew it. I'm a total drain on society. Although going for me is that I have AMAZING balance, though I don't own ANY lucite heels
Perhaps, I could panhandle for the heels and THEN start stripping.
What kind of benefit plans do they offer at Scores?
Oh and sadly, no iPad for me...just an iPhone and iPod Touch
I was able to purchase them with the money I'd have used to get health insurance.
I'll tell my sister that if a girl with lucite heels, sipping a latte and typing on LIF with her iPhone ever comes into her emergency room to just let her die. She doesn't deserve to live.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:34 PM |
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brownie
Baby #1 is here!
Member since 11/08 13903 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by JenniferEver
Can I just add that the person who wrote that giant sharpie note that started this post is going to be effed if she ever wants to buy a house?
She has no debt - no student loans?
And no credit cards- Therefore absolutely no credit credit history whatsoever.
ooohhhh, good call.
Oh snap!
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:35 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by brownie
Posted by JenniferEver
Can I just add that the person who wrote that giant sharpie note that started this post is going to be effed if she ever wants to buy a house?
She has no debt - no student loans?
And no credit cards- Therefore absolutely no credit credit history whatsoever.
ooohhhh, good call.
Oh snap!
Not such a smartypants anymore, now is she?
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:42 PM |
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HoneyBadger
YourWorstNightmare.
Member since 10/06 15979 total posts
Name:
BahBahBlackJeep
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by tarabelle99
Can you take out a student loan to cover the heels, outfits and lessons?
Oooh good thinking!! 
Posted by JenniferEver
I'll tell my sister that if a girl with lucite heels, sipping a latte and typing on LIF with her iPhone ever comes into her emergency room to just let her die. She doesn't deserve to live.
Good thinking! Save the system a buck or two!
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:43 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by stickydust
Posted by Ophelia
sticky, you say there is bullying and peole make outrageous comments, and then insult everyone who made a point on this thread.
"I find discourse invigorating and this discourse has a lot of passion which is great but unfortunately, what appears to be a lack of substance on all sides. There seems to be a lack of comprehension on the most basic of tenets of economic theory."
ok awesome. no more personal attacks.
How is that an insult? I don't know a lot about medicine, for example. If someone pointed that out to me I would not be I insulted, it is not my expertise. I stand by what I said their is passion and name calling but not a lot of facts.
really...you didn't say "you guys don't have much knowlege of complex economic issues" you said "There seems to be a lack of comprehension on the most basic of tenets of economic theory"
I think that is learned in high school
I mean I don't know. I professed my economic ignorance on another thread. or maybe this one. but I can tell when I don't like something.
someone else very learned posted something very similar to what you did, and it only served to depress me. it seems like from what you say, nothing can be changed. that is scary to me.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:44 PM |
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HoneyBadger
YourWorstNightmare.
Member since 10/06 15979 total posts
Name:
BahBahBlackJeep
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by brownie
Posted by JenniferEver
Can I just add that the person who wrote that giant sharpie note that started this post is going to be effed if she ever wants to buy a house?
She has no debt - no student loans?
And no credit cards- Therefore absolutely no credit credit history whatsoever.
ooohhhh, good call.
Oh snap!
Not such a smartypants anymore, now is she?
Matters not, she won't be able to afford a house while making minimum wage, "working her way up" and "putting in her time".
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:44 PM |
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smdl
I love Gary too..on a plate!
Member since 5/06 32461 total posts
Name:
me
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
I think BASIC health insurance is the BASIS of any Country calling themselves the "best" and classifying themselves as "civilized".
We COULD be like Africa. When people who don't have health insurance are not even treated in hospitals if they don't show insurance proof or cash.
We would be outraged if we saw on TV a little kid with a broken arm in a foreign Country being refused the entrance to the ER because his parents don't have insurance.
Why is that acceptable here?????
How do people sleep at night? aAnd if you do sleep tight at night... please don't fake being offended by foreign malnourished kids. Just look around. Look at the reality of our neighbors.
Look at the prices of houses. People with advanced degrees taking jobs at retail stores barely surviving basic needs and not being able to pay the mortgage anymore.
We are talking about people like our brothers, sisters, parents here.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:46 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Jennie0898
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by brownie
Posted by JenniferEver
Can I just add that the person who wrote that giant sharpie note that started this post is going to be effed if she ever wants to buy a house?
She has no debt - no student loans?
And no credit cards- Therefore absolutely no credit credit history whatsoever.
ooohhhh, good call.
Oh snap!
Not such a smartypants anymore, now is she?
Matters not, she won't be able to afford a house while making minimum wage, "working her way up" and "putting in her time".
Pish Posh. She works so much harder than the rest of us bums. She's going to work her way up and she's going to be making the big bucks someday! That's how the system should work!
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:48 PM |
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REKoz412
LIF Infant
Member since 5/10 148 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by MrsProfessor
Posted by MommyAgain
sorry but my view on this, comes from gut and morals..
That bum on the street, you have no friggen idea what their story is..maybe they were a baby born into it, maybe they had millions, and blew it..maybe they dont give a cr*p about your "society" and usually those are the homeless that wont even go to shelters or hospitals when theyre sick..
That drug addict..the one over there, who may or may not be related to your friend, cousin, daughter, neighbor, brother..
i cannot stand the "well, im better then THAT one over there" mentality...some of you need to pick up a bible, or go to temple or wherever you may worship and ask yourselves if ignoring simple humanity bc they choose, or just happen to get stuck with a different, less endearing path then you is ok with your soul. If you still feel "right" with your answer, please msg me, so i can pray that nothing terrible ever happens to you that would put you in these undesirable situations. We're talking about human life people. Now i know why i stay off here. 
This, more than anything, is why we are screwed. We saw it with the healthcare debate and we're seeing it again. Too many people don't give a **** about anyone but themselves and the immediate people in their world. They don't realize how fortunate they are.
I work hard, but I will never overlook the fact that having intelligent parents who took care of me the way they were supposed to helped, that I was born white and middle class, that my family valued education and hard work. Many people are not as fortunate, but that gets lost in all the "me, me, me."
OH Thank You SO much for posting this! Some people are so beyond unaware of the world outside their own. This "personal responsibility" mantra makes so much sense to them because that is the way they were brought up. Just like me, I had no conception of the fact that others did not experience life pretty close to the way I did. At least everybody had the chance to be successful or so I thought.
That people born into poverty and all that entails in the majority of cases ( absentee or drug addicted parents, deplorable living conditions, abuse etc. ) have the same notion of "personal responsibilty" as those of us more fortunate is laughable. Surely this is NOT something they have learned in their environment. Don't think they wanted to be born into it either.
IMO, it is not called "the golden rule" for nothing. Either for the sake of this argument or for the sake of this thread!
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:51 PM |
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ItsTime2011
Meh...
Member since 1/11 2148 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Ophelia
someone else very learned posted something very similar to what you did, and it only served to depress me. it seems like from what you say, nothing can be changed. that is scary to me.
This is what gets me on this whole thing. This "It is what it is" mindset. WHAT would be the solution. I don't profess to know much but what I do know is that the status quo is not good enough anymore. Somehow, someway we as the American people need to take back our country and our pride and talent instead of pimping it out to the highest bidder.
Posted by Stickydust
This example can be extrapolated to any manufacturing. So while we can control what happens in the us we cannot control non US companies from producing cheaper products and selling them here thus pricing American made goods out of the market. And well, Americans want to pay as little as they can for the best quality they can and they do not discriminate.
You examples and explanations are all clear and concise as to what the issue is with something like outsourcing. Since you seem to be educated in this subject I would be interested to know - as you have a grasp on the workings behind the problem what, in your opinion, would be a feasible solution for this dilemma.
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| Posted 10/18/11 3:58 PM |
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Hofstra26
Love to Bake!
Member since 7/06 27915 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by headoverheels
Woodsy.
You're not exempt from reading the entire thread just because you feel like it.
Hofstra26 said that people who contribute nothing to society in terms of earning a paycheck, paying into social security, a health insurance plan, whatever... since those are BENEFITS, that they don't deserve healthcare.
Ophelia and OTHERS said that since she's a SAHM, technically she's not doing any of those things herself.
She argued that her DH is doing it for her.
Some people don't agree that she's any different from any other unemployed person not paying into any of those funds.
You need to READ before passing judgment.
Of course Hofstra26 is entitled to her opinion, as much as others are for pointing out the obvious discrepancies between her views of others and how she views herself.
Please, just READ.
Actually, that wasn't how I worded it nor was that the point I was making. What everyone here did was latch on to one statement and spin their OWN version of what I meant.
I was NEVER referring to the person who lost their job. Not once!! I think that if someone loses their job then they absolutely should be given assistance and benefits until they get back on their feet. I think that is the right thing to do, no doubt. I think the elderly need assistance. I think that is the right thing to do. No question. They were NEVER who I was referring to.
My comments were ALL in reference to subset of people in our society that takes and takes but never contribute back. I was referring to people who never hold down a job, who don't make the effort, people who continually abuse the system.............such as the person who has baby after baby knowing FULL well they have NO means to support those children and sit on welfare forever. People who although they can work keep reaping disability benefits because they are lazy and get away with it. These are the people who I feel aren't entitled to a handout. These are the people I was talking about.
I don't think ANYONE deserves a free ride. EVERYTHING I have EVER had I have worked for and paid for. Whether it was "my" money, "his" money, or "our" money I never asked for anything from anyone. I may have left my job but I am a 100% contributing member of society. I paid into social security when I working. I pay my taxes every year. And yes, I am "entitled" to health benefits not because I'm so great but because my DH PAYS A LOT of money so my DD and I can be covered. And flat out, I don't distinguish between whose money pays for what. It is irrelevant. If one day we lost his income, I would go back to work and then it would be on me.
The constant harping on the fact that I am SAHM is idiotic. You're using that as an example to further YOUR arguments that NEVER made sense to begin with because your refuting something that was NEVER my point nor something I ever said. Not once.
I don't think it's illogical and crazy and heartless to expect that people pull their own weight and contribute in some way. Sitting on your a$$ getting knocked up every year and then expecting society to cover you is ridiculous. Losing your job and needing some help to get back on your feet..........that's a no brainer, that person is entitled to help. Being a SAHM, married to someone with a STEADY income paying my taxes, bills, healthcare costs, and more makes me a contributing member of our society. I don't need to bring home a paycheck in order to take care of my own. My DH and I are in this together. I raise our child so she can become a productive member of society and he supports us financially. We split the responsibilities and that works for us.
I'm sick of being called out for something that I didn't say. You've all spun this in a way to fit your arguments but what you have said in response never really had anything to do with my original comment. But whatever, such is LIF.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:11 PM |
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Hofstra26
Love to Bake!
Member since 7/06 27915 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by brownie
Posted by Hofstra26
I don't think everyone should be "entitled" (for lack of a better word) to the same things. (healthcare, housing, etc.) Some people have more valuable skills, more education, work harder, better luck, etc. etc. and as such should be compensated for that. I don't begrudge anyone with money, I can only do what I can to make my life the best it can be and hopefully give my DD and any future children a good life. Just sayin'.
Am I reading this right, you don't think everyone should be given healthcare?
Do I think the drug addict on the street contributing nothing to society in any way deserves healthcare when the rest of us have to work hard and pay for healthcare benefits? Then the answer is yes, I don't think EVERYONE deserves the SAME healthcare benefits. I have a problem with noncontributing members of society sucking benefits they don't deserve such as the mom with 8 kids who keeps getting pregnant and collecting welfare or the loser drug addict who hasn't worked a day in his life being given health benefits. Sorry, DH and I work hard for what we have. Nobody deserves a free handout.
THIS was my response. I don't see how THIS could have been misconstrued. I was pretty clear WHO I was referring to.
And I stand by what I originally wrote, everyone does NOT deserve the SAME benefits.
Message edited 10/18/2011 4:17:08 PM.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:16 PM |
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DiamondGirl
You are my I love you
Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
Name:
DiamondMama
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by brownie
Posted by Hofstra26
I don't think everyone should be "entitled" (for lack of a better word) to the same things. (healthcare, housing, etc.) Some people have more valuable skills, more education, work harder, better luck, etc. etc. and as such should be compensated for that. I don't begrudge anyone with money, I can only do what I can to make my life the best it can be and hopefully give my DD and any future children a good life. Just sayin'.
Am I reading this right, you don't think everyone should be given healthcare?
Do I think the drug addict on the street contributing nothing to society in any way deserves healthcare when the rest of us have to work hard and pay for healthcare benefits? Then the answer is yes, I don't think EVERYONE deserves the SAME healthcare benefits. I have a problem with noncontributing members of society sucking benefits they don't deserve such as the mom with 8 kids who keeps getting pregnant and collecting welfare or the loser drug addict who hasn't worked a day in his life being given health benefits. Sorry, DH and I work hard for what we have. Nobody deserves a free handout.
THIS was my response. I don't see how THIS could have been misconstrued. I was pretty clear WHO I was referring to.
And I stand by what I originally wrote, everyone does NOT deserve the SAME benefits.
Okay got it, so only those situations you can concievably see yourself in are deserving of health care. Anything you cannot relate to or are to naive to believe could ever happen/apply to you..THOSE people should not have access to anything. All clear now.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:23 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by DiamondGirl
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by brownie
Posted by Hofstra26
I don't think everyone should be "entitled" (for lack of a better word) to the same things. (healthcare, housing, etc.) Some people have more valuable skills, more education, work harder, better luck, etc. etc. and as such should be compensated for that. I don't begrudge anyone with money, I can only do what I can to make my life the best it can be and hopefully give my DD and any future children a good life. Just sayin'.
Am I reading this right, you don't think everyone should be given healthcare?
Do I think the drug addict on the street contributing nothing to society in any way deserves healthcare when the rest of us have to work hard and pay for healthcare benefits? Then the answer is yes, I don't think EVERYONE deserves the SAME healthcare benefits. I have a problem with noncontributing members of society sucking benefits they don't deserve such as the mom with 8 kids who keeps getting pregnant and collecting welfare or the loser drug addict who hasn't worked a day in his life being given health benefits. Sorry, DH and I work hard for what we have. Nobody deserves a free handout.
THIS was my response. I don't see how THIS could have been misconstrued. I was pretty clear WHO I was referring to.
And I stand by what I originally wrote, everyone does NOT deserve the SAME benefits.
Okay got it, so only those situations you can concievably see yourself in are deserving of health care. Anything you cannot relate to or are to naive to believe could ever happen/apply to you..THOSE people should not have access to anything. All clear now.
it also begs the question of who qualifies as having contributed to society, if the single mom with 8 kids worked for several years, does she get benefits? What if she has a husband and he works, but his job has no benefits? Is it different then? Is she then a contributor?How long does the addict have to have worked before he fell into addiction to have contributed?
What about the mentally and physically handicapped who can't work and have literally never worked. What should happen to them when they age off their parents' plans?
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:26 PM |
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HoneyBadger
YourWorstNightmare.
Member since 10/06 15979 total posts
Name:
BahBahBlackJeep
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by DiamondGirl
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by Hofstra26
Posted by brownie
Posted by Hofstra26
I don't think everyone should be "entitled" (for lack of a better word) to the same things. (healthcare, housing, etc.) Some people have more valuable skills, more education, work harder, better luck, etc. etc. and as such should be compensated for that. I don't begrudge anyone with money, I can only do what I can to make my life the best it can be and hopefully give my DD and any future children a good life. Just sayin'.
Am I reading this right, you don't think everyone should be given healthcare?
Do I think the drug addict on the street contributing nothing to society in any way deserves healthcare when the rest of us have to work hard and pay for healthcare benefits? Then the answer is yes, I don't think EVERYONE deserves the SAME healthcare benefits. I have a problem with noncontributing members of society sucking benefits they don't deserve such as the mom with 8 kids who keeps getting pregnant and collecting welfare or the loser drug addict who hasn't worked a day in his life being given health benefits. Sorry, DH and I work hard for what we have. Nobody deserves a free handout.
THIS was my response. I don't see how THIS could have been misconstrued. I was pretty clear WHO I was referring to.
And I stand by what I originally wrote, everyone does NOT deserve the SAME benefits.
Okay got it, so only those situations you can concievably see yourself in are deserving of health care. Anything you cannot relate to or are to naive to believe could ever happen/apply to you..THOSE people should not have access to anything. All clear now.
It's so much clearer for me!
Awesome.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:27 PM |
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rojerono
Happiest.
Member since 8/06 13803 total posts
Name:
Jeannie
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Hofstra.. here are a few of your statements in your own words:
**********************************
I don't think everyone should be "entitled" (for lack of a better word) to the same things. (healthcare, housing, etc.) Some people have more valuable skills, more education, work harder, better luck, etc. etc. and as such should be compensated for that. I don't begrudge anyone with money, I can only do what I can to make my life the best it can be and hopefully give my DD and any future children a good life.
Do I think the drug addict on the street contributing nothing to society in any way deserves healthcare when the rest of us have to work hard and pay for healthcare benefits? Then the answer is yes, I don't think EVERYONE deserves the SAME healthcare benefits. I have a problem with noncontributing members of society sucking benefits they don't deserve such as the mom with 8 kids who keeps getting pregnant and collecting welfare or the loser drug addict who hasn't worked a day in his life being given health benefits. Sorry, DH and I work hard for what we have. Nobody deserves a free handout.
Education, healthcare, etc. all costs money. I work hard, I pay taxes, I feel I've earned the right to send my child to a good school and be able to get good healthcare. I PAY for it. I don't think it's an entitlement thing. Good schools, good healthcare.........it all comes at a price. So I do take issue with the idea of just giving these things freely to someone who contributes nothing to our society as a whole. Sorry if that's not a popular opinion.
I understand that but we are paying into that pool of insurance. What I am talking about is the jobless, noncontributing member of society who is NOT paying into the system yet reaping the benefits of it. KWIM?
**********************************
You don't point out people who have lost their jobs through some misfortune.. but you don't explicitly exclude them either. Please stop for one moment, read your words and try to understand why people might be feeling that you come off as insensitive.
I actually feel you somewhat. I understand how frustrating it is to shell out money to people who don't seem to want to help themselves. But how do we qualify who is a suck and who is not? How do we determine that the girl over there with no job and no benefits is more entitled than the guy over there with no job and benefits? And who do we PAY to make these determinations.. and with what money will we pay those people to make these life altering decisions? Isn't it easier and less expensive to agree that certain things are actually HUMAN RIGHTS rather than entitlements that should be earned?
No - we can't all live in mansions and eat filet mignon and lobster daily. Nobody expects that every person should have private suites in the hospital or be able to go to Harvard. But in order for this country to stay great we MUST support each other on at least the most basic level - FOOD, SHELTER, EDUCATION and HEALTHCARE need to be available to EVERY SINGLE PERSON - even those without jobs. homes or hope.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:33 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
You have to be really careful when judging people based on their current situations. Without going into too much detail someone I know worked for many many years for a major multinational corporation. He was a highly valued employee and travelled the world working for them. He made a nice salary, bought several homes, cars, etc. He could afford all of it. He was in a catastrophic car accident that actually killed some people in it, but he miraculously survived. He was in a great deal of pain and I don't know how or why, if the doctors gave him too much, or he manipulated to get more, or if it was just the length of time he was on them, but he became horribly addicted to pain killers. This has started to completely unravel his life, as you can imagine.
He worked and contributed for DECADES before he was in the accident. Genetically in his family there is a history of addiction, and he is struggling with this addiction to the medications. it has taken over his life.
He's not a lazy bum who has never worked a day in his life. He's sick, and without a safety net, he and his family would be out on the street, even though he worked for many many years. He's LUCKY that his company has given him leave, etc and that his family is wealthy to support him. Imagine if those 2 things weren't in place and he were just completely fired and he didn't have family to help him support his kids. He could be on the street and just another "bum."
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:37 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by Hofstra26
And I stand by what I originally wrote, everyone does NOT deserve the SAME benefits.
so if your dh loses his job you'll just go back to work.
as a teacher.
on LI?
ok. 
even the nice non bully people on this thread see a current running through your posts, which coincidentally also run through other big threads on here.
I still think it's heinous that you believe that not all people still deserve health care. I am sorry. call me a vilifier. an evil judgmental *** a bully whatever.
civilizations rise and fall b/c of this type of thought throughout history. I have always said our civilization was no different than the great civilizations of the past. and the point has been proven.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:41 PM |
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brownie
Baby #1 is here!
Member since 11/08 13903 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by JenniferEver
You have to be really careful when judging people based on their current situations. Without going into too much detail someone I know worked for many many years for a major multinational corporation. He was a highly valued employee and travelled the world working for them. He made a nice salary, bought several homes, cars, etc. He could afford all of it. He was in a catastrophic car accident that actually killed some people in it, but he miraculously survived. He was in a great deal of pain and I don't know how or why, if the doctors gave him too much, or he manipulated to get more, or if it was just the length of time he was on them, but he became horribly addicted to pain killers. This has started to completely unravel his life, as you can imagine.
He worked and contributed for DECADES before he was in the accident. Genetically in his family there is a history of addiction, and he is struggling with this addiction to the medications. it has taken over his life.
He's not a lazy bum who has never worked a day in his life. He's sick, and without a safety net, he and his family would be out on the street, even though he worked for many many years. He's LUCKY that his company has given him leave, etc and that his family is wealthy to support him. Imagine if those 2 things weren't in place and he were just completely fired and he didn't have family to help him support his kids. He could be on the street and just another "bum."
Yep, I know many stories like this that are VERY similar
And also know many vets who come back from war, have bad PTSD and just can't get their life together again....so according to some people on this thread, we shouldn't help them because they're abusing the system
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:46 PM |
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Hofstra26
Love to Bake!
Member since 7/06 27915 total posts
Name:
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Re: On the subject of Occupy Wall St...
Posted by rojerono
Hofstra.. here are a few of your statements in your own words:
**********************************
I don't think everyone should be "entitled" (for lack of a better word) to the same things. (healthcare, housing, etc.) Some people have more valuable skills, more education, work harder, better luck, etc. etc. and as such should be compensated for that. I don't begrudge anyone with money, I can only do what I can to make my life the best it can be and hopefully give my DD and any future children a good life.
Do I think the drug addict on the street contributing nothing to society in any way deserves healthcare when the rest of us have to work hard and pay for healthcare benefits? Then the answer is yes, I don't think EVERYONE deserves the SAME healthcare benefits. I have a problem with noncontributing members of society sucking benefits they don't deserve such as the mom with 8 kids who keeps getting pregnant and collecting welfare or the loser drug addict who hasn't worked a day in his life being given health benefits. Sorry, DH and I work hard for what we have. Nobody deserves a free handout.
Education, healthcare, etc. all costs money. I work hard, I pay taxes, I feel I've earned the right to send my child to a good school and be able to get good healthcare. I PAY for it. I don't think it's an entitlement thing. Good schools, good healthcare.........it all comes at a price. So I do take issue with the idea of just giving these things freely to someone who contributes nothing to our society as a whole. Sorry if that's not a popular opinion.
I understand that but we are paying into that pool of insurance. What I am talking about is the jobless, noncontributing member of society who is NOT paying into the system yet reaping the benefits of it. KWIM?
**********************************
You don't point out people who have lost their jobs through some misfortune.. but you don't explicitly exclude them either. Please stop for one moment, read your words and try to understand why people might be feeling that you come off as insensitive.
I actually feel you somewhat. I understand how frustrating it is to shell out money to people who don't seem to want to help themselves. But how do we qualify who is a suck and who is not? How do we determine that the girl over there with no job and no benefits is more entitled than the guy over there with no job and benefits? And who do we PAY to make these determinations.. and with what money will we pay those people to make these life altering decisions? Isn't it easier and less expensive to agree that certain things are actually HUMAN RIGHTS rather than entitlements that should be earned?
No - we can't all live in mansions and eat filet mignon and lobster daily. Nobody expects that every person should have private suites in the hospital or be able to go to Harvard. But in order for this country to stay great we MUST support each other on at least the most basic level - FOOD, SHELTER, EDUCATION and HEALTHCARE need to be available to EVERY SINGLE PERSON - even those without jobs. homes or hope.
I can appreciate what you're saying and you're right, there is no way to determine anything for sure. I wouldn't argue that point.
I think that ultimately it's a tough issue with no clear cut "right answer" because when things come down to cost and money it's never easy. You will never be able to please everyone either. Such is life.
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| Posted 10/18/11 4:49 PM |
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