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rojerono
Happiest.
Member since 8/06 13803 total posts
Name:
Jeannie
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by rojerono
Posted by laurabora
I feel blessed to have been born, raised and to make my home in the United States. But when I hear politicians (or anyone really) say that we are the greatest country in the world, I cringe. It is the height of arrogance to claim our country is better than anyone else's.
And it is not un-American in the least to feel this way. What it IS is understanding that we are not the center of the world, the only country that has things that make it wonderful or a nice place to make your home. We are a great nation, but other nations are great too.
As Americans we are not perfect, and many, many things are clearly not ideal with our government and society. Our government was formed with the intention that we can change and grow as the world changes. It is our responsibility to question, to share our ideas and to make changes happen when necessary.
I have the greatest husband in the world. I have the best kids in the universe. I have said that before and I believe it with all my heart. My husband doesn't give me roses everyday or sing me love songs in the kitchen and sometimes he is grumpy and says sh*t that makes me want to smack him. My kids aren't uber geniuses and they have nasty temper tantrums and don't always do their chores when they are told.. but I still think they are the best. I wouldn't trade them for ANYTHING.
Does that mean I'm a terrible arrogant asshole? Or is it just a way for me to express how blessed and happy I feel to have what I have?
I think it's actually a red herring in the case of politicians.
don't look over there....Wee are the greatest. don't see how anything can be changed improved. we are the best. sotp looking to them. they are below us. evil doers. SOCIALISTS!! haha
and Jeannie, your husband IS actually pretty awesome. as are you kids. so I find it totally believable and credible when you say that stuff.  
HA! Talk about a red herring.. complimenting my family..  
But to your point.. YES a lot of politicians use that term to whip people into a state of nationalist frenzy. The US politicos aren't the ONLY ones to employ that tactic.
But we're a smart bunch, aren't we? We don't need anyone to TELL us what's good and what's bad. We can see it. We can recognize it. We can be proud. We can cheer when Obama says he is proud to lead this great nation.. but that cheering doesn't mean we are deaf, dumb and blind to the challenges around us. It means we recognize are blessings, we are thrilled to be a part of something as special as this country and we are willing to do the work that needs to be done to progress.
I thought this was pretty nifty too.
Best part:
"We are a beacon for the world. Our challenge is not to lament our decline or even celebrate our exceptionalism; it is to come together with true leadership that can unite us as we sacrifice to preserve and expand our greatness."
Message edited 1/11/2013 11:13:38 AM.
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Posted 1/11/13 11:12 AM  |
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casey31
Mommy of 3!
Member since 5/05 2967 total posts
Name:
Mommy to two boys and a girl
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
I believe we are the greatest country in the world.
We are not perfect- but we are the land of immigrants- we have the American dream.
More people come to our country for a better way of life than any other country in the world- that is what makes us the greatest.
It is because we are the FREEST country in the world- although that is slowly being erroded by Obama. 
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| Posted 1/11/13 11:57 AM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:00 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by rojerono
HA! Talk about a red herring.. complimenting my family..
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:03 PM |
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MandJZ
Time for Baby #2!
Member since 8/10 4194 total posts
Name:
M
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
The freedom to be uninsured and unhealthy, if you so choose. Obviously.
Back to being positive now.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:05 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
this thread has just
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:08 PM |
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eroxgirl
My Loves
Member since 5/05 15697 total posts
Name:
Rebecca
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by Ophelia
this thread has just
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:10 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
The freedom to be uninsured and unhealthy, if you so choose. Obviously.
Back to being positive now.
can either of you explain the NDAA and the right to indefinitely detain citizens without a charge to me?
for real...not sarcastically, because I only know what I've read and I don't know enough about it, but from what I do know it seems like fishy business. I know the NDAA is something that has been signed every year and is geared more towards budget...but it has other provisions, one of which is indefinite detention of citizens without a charge. From what I understand he has signed the act without banning that but then made a statement saying he wouldn't authorize such indefinite detentions? then why keep it in the NDAA?
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:12 PM |
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ElizaRags35
My 2 Girls
Member since 2/09 20494 total posts
Name:
Me
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:13 PM |
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MandJZ
Time for Baby #2!
Member since 8/10 4194 total posts
Name:
M
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
The freedom to be uninsured and unhealthy, if you so choose. Obviously.
Back to being positive now.
can either of you explain the NDAA and the right to indefinitely detain citizens without a charge to me?
for real...not sarcastically, because I only know what I've read and I don't know enough about it, but from what I do know it seems like fishy business. I know the NDAA is something that has been signed every year and is geared more towards budget...but it has other provisions, one of which is indefinite detention of citizens without a charge. From what I understand he has signed the act without banning that but then made a statement saying he wouldn't authorize such indefinite detentions? then why keep it in the NDAA?
But...the question was what freedoms Obama specifically has eroded. This is an Act that was put into place by BUSH. So while Obama may not have gotten rid of it he certainly isn't the one who initially took the freedom away (if that's how you look at it).
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:15 PM |
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DaniJude
You're My Home <3
Member since 11/06 14815 total posts
Name:
Danielle
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
In the words of my crotchety yet awesome 91 year old grandmother: If the other countries are so wonderful, get on a plane, there are flights leaving everyday 
I love this country, we are not perfect, no one is, but it is the best damn country there ever was and ever will be. Any suggestion otherwise makes my blood boil, my grandfathers, uncles, and father almost died for the wonderful things we have in America, MY America - and I'll be damned if my granddaddy got shot in the foot, contracted malaria, and watched most of his friends get slaughtered to have anyone turn their nose up at the USA like it's not good enough for them. NEVER APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE FOR BEING PATRIOTIC!
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:16 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
The freedom to be uninsured and unhealthy, if you so choose. Obviously.
Back to being positive now.
can either of you explain the NDAA and the right to indefinitely detain citizens without a charge to me?
for real...not sarcastically, because I only know what I've read and I don't know enough about it, but from what I do know it seems like fishy business. I know the NDAA is something that has been signed every year and is geared more towards budget...but it has other provisions, one of which is indefinite detention of citizens without a charge. From what I understand he has signed the act without banning that but then made a statement saying he wouldn't authorize such indefinite detentions? then why keep it in the NDAA?
the Senate voted 98-1 to keep it in. his veto would have been met with an override.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:19 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by DaniRella
In the words of my crotchety yet awesome 91 year old grandmother: If the other countries are so wonderful, get on a plane, there are flights leaving everyday
I love this country, we are not perfect, no one is, but it is the best damn country there ever was and ever will be. Any suggestion otherwise makes my blood boil, my grandfathers, uncles, and father almost died for the wonderful things we have in America, MY America - and I'll be damned if my granddaddy got shot in the foot, contracted malaria, and watched most of his friends get slaughtered to have anyone turn their nose up at the USA like it's not good enough for them. NEVER APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE FOR BEING PATRIOTIC!
I don't think it's turning anyone's noses up. At least for me, it's about wanting to continue to fight to uphold the values your family and so many other have fought for.
There's a big difference to saying "I love my country, but I know it is flawed"
and saying "THE US IS THE BEST! EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT AS AWESOME"
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:19 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
The freedom to be uninsured and unhealthy, if you so choose. Obviously.
Back to being positive now.
can either of you explain the NDAA and the right to indefinitely detain citizens without a charge to me?
for real...not sarcastically, because I only know what I've read and I don't know enough about it, but from what I do know it seems like fishy business. I know the NDAA is something that has been signed every year and is geared more towards budget...but it has other provisions, one of which is indefinite detention of citizens without a charge. From what I understand he has signed the act without banning that but then made a statement saying he wouldn't authorize such indefinite detentions? then why keep it in the NDAA?
But...the question was what freedoms Obama specifically has eroded. This is an Act that was put into place by BUSH. So while Obama may not have gotten rid of it he certainly isn't the one who initially took the freedom away (if that's how you look at it).
I understand. I didn't really know much about it when bush was in office. I just thought it was odd to acknowledge it but not get rid of it if it's not something he stood behind. It's kind of a scary thought regardless who is behind it really.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:19 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by JenniferEver
Oh here we go.
Please tell me the freedoms you had on Jan 19 2009 that you lack today.
The freedom to be uninsured and unhealthy, if you so choose. Obviously.
Back to being positive now.
can either of you explain the NDAA and the right to indefinitely detain citizens without a charge to me?
for real...not sarcastically, because I only know what I've read and I don't know enough about it, but from what I do know it seems like fishy business. I know the NDAA is something that has been signed every year and is geared more towards budget...but it has other provisions, one of which is indefinite detention of citizens without a charge. From what I understand he has signed the act without banning that but then made a statement saying he wouldn't authorize such indefinite detentions? then why keep it in the NDAA?
the Senate voted 98-1 to keep it in. his veto would have been met with an override.
Thank you...sorry to sidetrack the convo for a moment, but I am trying to gain some perspective.
98-1...am I missing why INDEFINITE detention without charge would be so necessary that 98-1 would be for it?
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:22 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
98-1...am I missing why INDEFINITE detention without charge would be so necessary that 98-1 would be for it?
b/c of the way counter-terrorism is investigated I would imagine.
this is not for citizens UNLESS they are suspected of being terrorist. that is a HUGE difference.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:24 PM |
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DaniJude
You're My Home <3
Member since 11/06 14815 total posts
Name:
Danielle
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JenniferEver
I don't think it's turning anyone's noses up. At least for me, it's about wanting to continue to fight to uphold the values your family and so many other have fought for.
There's a big difference to saying "I love my country, but I know it is flawed"
and saying "THE US IS THE BEST! EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT AS AWESOME"
Alright, I understand. But that's what is great about America and I always say, I hope those who critique it remember WHY they can, it's b/c of our freedoms. So, that being said, you have the right to say you want out -- and that's my main point, if it is better elsewhere, make a change.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:24 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by DaniRella
In the words of my crotchety yet awesome 91 year old grandmother: If the other countries are so wonderful, get on a plane, there are flights leaving everyday
I love this country, we are not perfect, no one is, but it is the best damn country there ever was and ever will be. Any suggestion otherwise makes my blood boil, my grandfathers, uncles, and father almost died for the wonderful things we have in America, MY America - and I'll be damned if my granddaddy got shot in the foot, contracted malaria, and watched most of his friends get slaughtered to have anyone turn their nose up at the USA like it's not good enough for them. NEVER APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE FOR BEING PATRIOTIC!
I don't think it's turning anyone's noses up. At least for me, it's about wanting to continue to fight to uphold the values your family and so many other have fought for.
There's a big difference to saying "I love my country, but I know it is flawed"
and saying "THE US IS THE BEST! EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT AS AWESOME"
I agree ... "I love my country, but I know it is flawed" this is how I feel. I love this country...but we need some work. We are not perfect...and I also agree with someone elses previously posted sentiment that there are so many rich cultures all over the world, also flawed, but worthy of praise and respect as well. "THE US IS THE BEST! EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT AS AWESOME" is definitely the mentally I speak towards when I say I won't sit here and say we are the greatest country in the world...not that we aren't great...but the need to compare to the whole world like it's a competition I feel closes us off from learning and makes us arrogant.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:26 PM |
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JennP
LIF Adult
Member since 10/06 3986 total posts
Name:
Jenn
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by DaniRella
In the words of my crotchety yet awesome 91 year old grandmother: If the other countries are so wonderful, get on a plane, there are flights leaving everyday
I love this country, we are not perfect, no one is, but it is the best damn country there ever was and ever will be. Any suggestion otherwise makes my blood boil, my grandfathers, uncles, and father almost died for the wonderful things we have in America, MY America - and I'll be damned if my granddaddy got shot in the foot, contracted malaria, and watched most of his friends get slaughtered to have anyone turn their nose up at the USA like it's not good enough for them. NEVER APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE FOR BEING PATRIOTIC!
I don't think it's turning anyone's noses up. At least for me, it's about wanting to continue to fight to uphold the values your family and so many other have fought for.
There's a big difference to saying "I love my country, but I know it is flawed"
and saying "THE US IS THE BEST! EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT AS AWESOME"
I never understood the "love it or leave it" argument.
So, you can't try to make things better?
My marriage is in a rough spot right now but we're working on things. By that logic, should I just leave him?.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:28 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
98-1...am I missing why INDEFINITE detention without charge would be so necessary that 98-1 would be for it?
b/c of the way counter-terrorism is investigated I would imagine.
this is not for citizens UNLESS they are suspected of being terrorist. that is a HUGE difference.
Thats what I figured...I just thought there would be something specifically in regards to terrorism addressed in the act. I also figured if there was substantial evidence enough to withhold a person that they could be CHARGED with aiding or withholding intelligence re: terrorism and be tried.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:30 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JennP
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by DaniRella
In the words of my crotchety yet awesome 91 year old grandmother: If the other countries are so wonderful, get on a plane, there are flights leaving everyday
I love this country, we are not perfect, no one is, but it is the best damn country there ever was and ever will be. Any suggestion otherwise makes my blood boil, my grandfathers, uncles, and father almost died for the wonderful things we have in America, MY America - and I'll be damned if my granddaddy got shot in the foot, contracted malaria, and watched most of his friends get slaughtered to have anyone turn their nose up at the USA like it's not good enough for them. NEVER APOLOGIZE TO ANYONE FOR BEING PATRIOTIC!
I don't think it's turning anyone's noses up. At least for me, it's about wanting to continue to fight to uphold the values your family and so many other have fought for.
There's a big difference to saying "I love my country, but I know it is flawed"
and saying "THE US IS THE BEST! EVERYONE ELSE IS NOT AS AWESOME"
I never understood the "love it or leave it" argument.
So, you can't try to make things better?
My marriage is in a rough spot right now but we're working on things. By that logic, should I just leave him?.
Throw in the towel, Jenn.
LOL
That's actually a great comparison. it's actually just as annoying and shoirtsighted as people who say "my husband is the most perfect amazing creature and our marriage is perfect" while ignoring problems.
instead of "I love my husband and wouldn't trade him but damn can't he PUT THE DAMN SEAT DOWN"
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:31 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
98-1...am I missing why INDEFINITE detention without charge would be so necessary that 98-1 would be for it?
b/c of the way counter-terrorism is investigated I would imagine.
this is not for citizens UNLESS they are suspected of being terrorist. that is a HUGE difference.
Thats what I figured...I just thought there would be something specifically in regards to terrorism addressed in the act. I also figured if there was substantial evidence enough to withhold a person that they could be CHARGED with aiding or withholding intelligence re: terrorism and be tried.
I really worry about this and all of this bothers me. We get to define what terrorism is to do this, and I just don't think we should be able to take anyone's rights away to that extent and with so little transparency. But I feel we have to hold up these standards because you can't be "weak on terror"
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:32 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
98-1...am I missing why INDEFINITE detention without charge would be so necessary that 98-1 would be for it?
b/c of the way counter-terrorism is investigated I would imagine.
this is not for citizens UNLESS they are suspected of being terrorist. that is a HUGE difference.
Thats what I figured...I just thought there would be something specifically in regards to terrorism addressed in the act. I also figured if there was substantial evidence enough to withhold a person that they could be CHARGED with aiding or withholding intelligence re: terrorism and be tried.
I really worry about this and all of this bothers me. We get to define what terrorism is to do this, and I just don't think we should be able to take anyone's rights away to that extent and with so little transparency. But I feel we have to hold up these standards because you can't be "weak on terror"
thats what scares me too...the lack of transparency. It's so loosely defined that it could be used for anything.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:36 PM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by MrsMeloyellow
98-1...am I missing why INDEFINITE detention without charge would be so necessary that 98-1 would be for it?
b/c of the way counter-terrorism is investigated I would imagine.
this is not for citizens UNLESS they are suspected of being terrorist. that is a HUGE difference.
Thats what I figured...I just thought there would be something specifically in regards to terrorism addressed in the act. I also figured if there was substantial evidence enough to withhold a person that they could be CHARGED with aiding or withholding intelligence re: terrorism and be tried.
I really worry about this and all of this bothers me. We get to define what terrorism is to do this, and I just don't think we should be able to take anyone's rights away to that extent and with so little transparency. But I feel we have to hold up these standards because you can't be "weak on terror"
thats what scares me too...the lack of transparency. It's so loosely defined that it could be used for anything.
it's really not loosely defined in the text at all.
NDAA
it's pretty specific.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:42 PM |
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hotsauce345
my love, my life, my son
Member since 1/09 4169 total posts
Name:
Melody
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Re: "America is not the greatest country in the world"
that link takes me to LIF quote...can you please re-link?
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:47 PM |
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