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DancinBarefoot
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Member since 1/07 9534 total posts
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The One My Mother Gave Me ;-)
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by Pray4Baby2010
I have to disagree with the ignorance comment- I know for myself, it is a sensitivity thing- I thought about how I would feel if I had lost someone and I had to pass this 13 story mosque when I went down there to pay my respects- and sorry it just didnt sound like the right place for me.
I would also be shocked if I was the only one that felt that way- there was quite a stir about it in the news
how or why do you think it would be different to pass one there or any place else?
what if the assailants were Christinas? should we tear down Trinity Church? The Church of St. Peter and St. Paul?
every day there is a muslim call to prayer (I guess it's twice a day?) on Atlantic Avenue close to my apt. close to a few fire houses that lost men in the 9-11 attacks. should they have requested that the call be outlawed? b/c a religiou icon served to remind them of something?
It is different to pass a mosque on your way to Ground Zero if you are going there to mourn the loss of a loved one. Look at all the mini-shrines along the highway where people have died. Can you imagine a liquor store opening up on the Taconic Parkway near the Schuler crash site??
It's just insensitive.
FTR - not only did I know someone who died at the Towers on 9/11, I also know someone that barely escaped death at the Pentagon that fateful day.
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Posted 8/17/10 9:41 PM  |
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LemonHead
Sour Girl
Member since 3/08 5271 total posts
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by MangoMama
Posted by faithann
Posted by dm24angel
Its not a home for wayward radical's to plot...Its a place for people to worship God, the same God we all do.
I'm not necessarily against this mosque- but it's not being built to worship "the same God we all do".
I'm a Christian. Muslims believe in worshipping one God- and so do I. But they are not the same God. I'm sure any Muslim would feel the same way.
I'm not trying to insult anyone- there are major theological differences between our religions. Anyone who is serious about their religion would not want it grouped with another in a blanket kumbaya statement.
Sorry I made you faint.
Message edited 8/17/2010 9:49:30 PM.
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| Posted 8/17/10 9:47 PM |
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Arieschick29
aries+cancer= pisces&gemini
Member since 3/06 4268 total posts
Name:
Jen
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
So what I'm getting is that those against don't necessarily think its a matter of it's not right but it's just not nice/ insensitive due to location
What if a Walmart decided to build a store on that whole city block?
Would it be insensitive to treat what some call "sacred ground" as a commercial warehouse?
Where will these "rules", about what can be built or can't , finally stop?
Will the area around the WTC ever be rebuilt - there are tons of stores and buildings still lying desolate since 2001.
Wouldn't it be a far better tribute to those lost to bring NYC and the WTC area back to what it was than fight to keep it empty because of what happened????
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| Posted 8/17/10 9:52 PM |
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Shelly
She's 7!!!
Member since 8/05 14624 total posts
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by mrsboss
Liken it to building an amusement park or a Mcdonalds at/near Auschwitz - it's just plain disrespectful in my opinion, where such a tragedy occurred. While we're at it, let's build a sushi buffet at Pearl Harbor. Then a KKK meeting hall at/near where MLK was shot in Memphis. 
Auschwitz IS actually a park right next to the museum. Its odd to see people picnicing while when i was there to see the museum on the site of the concenctration camp.
That being said, I'll be honest. I would prefer it if they would build the mosque somewhere else. Would I protest, no. I wouldn't even post that stupid thing on my Facebook page. Do they have the right to build it there- yes. But honestly, I prefer that they weren't south of Chambers. Just my own personal opinion of having worked down the block from the WTC, being a Jew, and the daughter and wife of Israelis.
Yes, it was a few extremist that masterminded and carried out the attack. And no, I don't think all muslims are terrorists. I realize that some victims of the 9/11 attack were Muslims. But the fact that so many Muslims support Hamas shows me that on some level, a lot of Muslims have similar general views about Americans and Jews. I don't think that 90% of the world's Muslims would do anything violent- but I'm just a little uncomfortable with it. But hey, just because I'm uncomfortable with it doesn't mean they can't or shouldn't do it. I'm uncomfortable with yet another bank opening up in my neighborhood but I certainly think they have a right to open up where ever they want.
On the flip side, if they make efforts to help rebuild and reach out to the commuinty, and make efforts to bridge the gap between Muslims and non-Muslims, I would be very impressed and think it would be a great asset to the community.
Message edited 8/17/2010 9:54:07 PM.
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| Posted 8/17/10 9:53 PM |
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Bellaocchi
Hope Faith Love
Member since 2/07 5694 total posts
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Why is it that our wonderful president recently appointed the founder of the Mosque as Good Will Ambassador? Does this make anyone else uneasy?
In regards to the Mosque, what if we were to build a religious building very close to a place where thousands of their Muslim people had been murdered? How do you think they would take it?
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| Posted 8/17/10 9:55 PM |
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Goldi0218
My miracles!
Member since 12/05 23902 total posts
Name:
Leslie
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by Shelly
Posted by mrsboss
Liken it to building an amusement park or a Mcdonalds at/near Auschwitz - it's just plain disrespectful in my opinion, where such a tragedy occurred. While we're at it, let's build a sushi buffet at Pearl Harbor. Then a KKK meeting hall at/near where MLK was shot in Memphis.
Auschwitz IS actually a park right next to the museum. Its odd to see people picnicing while when i was there to see the museum on the site of the concenctration camp.
That being said, I'll be honest. I would prefer it if they would build the mosque somewhere else. Would I protest, no. I wouldn't even post that stupid thing on my Facebook page. Do they have the right to build it there- yes. But honestly, I prefer that they weren't south of Chambers. Just my own personal opinion of having worked down the block from the WTC, being a Jew, and the daughter and wife of Israelis.
Yes, it was a few extremist that masterminded and carried out the attack. And no, I don't think all muslims are terrorists. I realize that some victims of the 9/11 attack were Muslims. But the fact that so many Muslims support Hamas shows me that on some level, a lot of Muslims have similar general views about Americans and Jews. I don't think that 90% of the world's Muslims would do anything violent- but I'm just a little uncomfortable with it. But hey, just because I'm uncomfortable with it doesn't mean they can't or shouldn't do it. I'm uncomfortable with yet another bank opening up in my neighborhood but I certainly think they have a right to open up where ever they want.
On the flip side, if they make efforts to help rebuild and reach out to the commuinty, and make efforts to bridge the gap between Muslims and non-Muslims, I would be very impressed and think it would be a great asset to the community.
Thank you for so eloquently saying what I couldn't.
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| Posted 8/17/10 9:57 PM |
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SweetTooth
I'm a tired mommy!
Member since 12/05 20105 total posts
Name:
Lauren
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by Bellaocchi
Why is it that our wonderful president recently appointed the founder of the Mosque as Good Will Ambassador? Does this make anyone else uneasy?
In regards to the Mosque, what if we were to build a religious building very close to a place where thousands of their Muslim people had been murdered? How do you think they would take it?
I'm not going to even comment on the first part of your statement because it is just beyond ridiculous.
As for the second part, who exactly do you mean by "we?"
You say "what if WE were to build a religious building..."
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| Posted 8/17/10 10:35 PM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
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Its not religion I was lumping..it was God....a christian believes in one God...complete oness..that means all people worship "their" one true God as there cannot in the essence of the word be another....and many Muslims DO believe we share a God as well...the differences are huge but the concept is simple....One God.
Not going to make this a relgious debate though...but stand by my kumbaya moment and will always hope (wish) more would too.
There are good and bad of every race, color, relgion..I base my judgement on individuals and don't believe in condemning the whole...or maybe condemn is a hard word... iit just seems unfair to me.
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| Posted 8/17/10 10:54 PM |
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Palebride
I am an amazing bakist
Member since 5/05 13673 total posts
Name:
Lori
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by Bellaocchi
In regards to the Mosque, what if we were to build a religious building very close to a place where thousands of their Muslim people had been murdered? How do you think they would take it?
Well, considering Muslim people WERE murdered in the twin towers on 9/11....I'm guessing they'd be ok with it.
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| Posted 8/17/10 11:02 PM |
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Bellaocchi
Hope Faith Love
Member since 2/07 5694 total posts
Name:
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Pale Bride- You know what? That's right. I stand corrected.
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| Posted 8/17/10 11:06 PM |
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neenie
Member since 5/05 22351 total posts
Name:
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by Shelly
That being said, I'll be honest. I would prefer it if they would build the mosque somewhere else. Would I protest, no. I wouldn't even post that stupid thing on my Facebook page. Do they have the right to build it there- yes. But honestly, I prefer that they weren't south of Chambers.
ITA. When it comes down to it, i guess i'd just consider myself indifferent to it, but i do have to admit that when i heard about them building it there i definitely cringed a bit. Of course they're free to do whatever they choose, but something about it just seemed... unnecessary, i guess. Too controversial for a wound that is still so sore for so many.
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| Posted 8/17/10 11:13 PM |
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JoesWife628
Our family is complete :)
Member since 8/08 3934 total posts
Name:
Me
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Many people have ill-feelings toward building a mosque near ground zero. I understand that our country was founded on religious freedom and how we can't pick and choose, instead we need to be consistent so our rights are never violated. Many of the people who have ill-feelings see those who committed the acts on 9/11 as Muslims, and even if they are wrong, most of those people no matter how much information they get, will always consider the terrorists Muslims rather than extremists. Honestly, I do not believe it should be built there because I see it opening up and creating more hatred towards Muslims because people believe it is insensitive (whether they are right or wrong doesn't matter). I'd actually be afraid to step foot near that mosque for the fact that it only takes one extremist who feels that it is insensitive to build a mosque that close to ground zero, to go crazy and try to blow up the mosque thus killing even more innocent lives in lower Manhattan. Maybe I am getting too far ahead of myself, but I believe if arrangements are made and the mosque is built elsewhere, perhaps people would have more tolerance for Muslims and maybe would see these people for what they are: people who want to worship.
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| Posted 8/17/10 11:17 PM |
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MrsH2009
Thank you St. Gerard!
Member since 8/09 6631 total posts
Name:
M
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
I really hesitate posting on this topic b.c I have no connection to 9/11 at all and can't possibly begin to imagine what victims' family members experience every day, but I got this sent on FB and thought it was interesting.
http://daryllang.com/blog/4421
No it does not address the fact that it is a mosque, not another religious institution, but it does address the fact that this is a regular neighborhood with a variety of businesses.
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| Posted 8/17/10 11:23 PM |
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Mushesgirl
Too blessed to be stressed
Member since 4/09 6691 total posts
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Just because it is Constitutionally protected and legal, does not make it *automatically* the right thing to do.
People calling other people ignorant because of their views is just, well, ignorant. There's this other thing called Freedom of Speech...
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| Posted 8/17/10 11:51 PM |
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waterspout4
My loves
Member since 5/06 19150 total posts
Name:
Kelly
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by JoesWife628
Many people have ill-feelings toward building a mosque near ground zero. I understand that our country was founded on religious freedom and how we can't pick and choose, instead we need to be consistent so our rights are never violated. Many of the people who have ill-feelings see those who committed the acts on 9/11 as Muslims, and even if they are wrong, most of those people no matter how much information they get, will always consider the terrorists Muslims rather than extremists. Honestly, I do not believe it should be built there because I see it opening up and creating more hatred towards Muslims because people believe it is insensitive (whether they are right or wrong doesn't matter). I'd actually be afraid to step foot near that mosque for the fact that it only takes one extremist who feels that it is insensitive to build a mosque that close to ground zero, to go crazy and try to blow up the mosque thus killing even more innocent lives in lower Manhattan. Maybe I am getting too far ahead of myself, but I believe if arrangements are made and the mosque is built elsewhere, perhaps people would have more tolerance for Muslims and maybe would see these people for what they are: people who want to worship.
This is basically exactly what I wanted to say. No matter the feelings, there are MANY out there that are distraught. Would they be right in bringing violence? Hell no! But many are very upset. Why poke the bear?
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| Posted 8/18/10 4:11 AM |
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PearlJamChick
No one sings like you anymore.
Member since 7/10 9264 total posts
Name:
Petticoated Swashbuckler
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by dm24angel
.
Its not religion I was lumping..it was God....a christian believes in one God...complete oness..that means all people worship "their" one true God as there cannot in the essence of the word be another....and many Muslims DO believe we share a God as well...the differences are huge but the concept is simple....One God.
Not going to make this a relgious debate though...but stand by my kumbaya moment and will always hope (wish) more would too.
There are good and bad of every race, color, relgion..I base my judgement on individuals and don't believe in condemning the whole...or maybe condemn is a hard word... iit just seems unfair to me.
As a Christian married to a Muslim, you are completely right in your statement that we do share the same God.
DH and I waver on the idea of this community center. The founders have made a few less-than-sensitive statements to press; however, we are very much familiar with them and a wonderful organization that they run, and initially had very high hopes for the center.
I hate being afraid to do something due to the idea of retaliation, but some comments I've heard - and let me stress, NOT anything said here - makes me wonder if it will be worth it in the long-run. All it takes is a few crazies to act out, either toward individuals entering or leaving, or in an attack on the building itself.
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| Posted 8/18/10 7:40 AM |
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dm24angel
Happiness
Member since 5/05 34581 total posts
Name:
Donna
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by Mushesgirl
Just because it is Constitutionally protected and legal, does not make it *automatically* the right thing to do.
People calling other people ignorant because of their views is just, well, ignorant. There's this other thing called Freedom of Speech...
you can SAY all your want, doesnt make it true, right, moral,smart etc.
You can FEEL anyway you want, doesn't mean because it's your opnion its right, moral, true etc.
I think the butting of heads here is because some of us think all people deserve the same rights and respect, regardless of where they are from, who they worship etc. Its what our COUNTRY was FOUDNED FOR.
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| Posted 8/18/10 8:48 AM |
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annoyedTTCer
LIF Adult
Member since 4/09 3272 total posts
Name:
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
How do you think a Roman Catholic Church would do in downtown Bagdad, Tehran or Kabul?
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| Posted 8/18/10 9:27 AM |
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Arieschick29
aries+cancer= pisces&gemini
Member since 3/06 4268 total posts
Name:
Jen
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by annoyedTTCer
How do you think a Roman Catholic Church would do in downtown Bagdad, Tehran or Kabul?
The difference is here in America, we founded our country based on tolerance and freedom from religious persecution.
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| Posted 8/18/10 9:36 AM |
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MrsKS
Thank You St. Gerard.....
Member since 12/09 8306 total posts
Name:
Kerri
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
I believe that they have the right to build the mosque there but out of respect for the families of the thousands who lost their lives that day, they should not. I don’t believe that the state or the government should stop the building of the mosque. But I do think they should choose to not cause this war over it and just pick another location.
Judging from the pictures posted, those 2 blocks look VERY short and the location of the mosque is VERY close to the location of the towers. I’m positive ashes from burning bodies and flesh made it over to that location. I think 4 blocks is far enough away; just enough so that it’s not RIGHT there. Those 2 blocks makes a difference.
I think just from the turmoil this is causing and the way the families who were already robbed of a loved one are feeling over it, it would be respectful to choose another location and keep the peace. If peace is what people want then do things where the outcome would be peaceful. There’s far too much negativity surrounding this whole situation and it’s only going to breed more negativity because it’s giving some of the “ignorant” people fuel for their flames. Especially since they were offered another location and declined; knowing that building there is causing issues. I believe that if they chose not to build there they would win the respect of many people and the bridge between the two can actually begin.
I have NOTHING at all against Muslims, their beliefs or them being a part of America. One of my favorite people in this world and a BM in my wedding is Muslim. I understand that they also lost loved ones there. I completely understand that the general Muslim practicing person is not a terrorist and doesn’t believe in the same ideologies that the extremists and terrorists believe in.
I just think that for sensitivity around this entire issue and the negativity surrounding building a Mosque in that particular location just adds up to a bad idea and it should be located elsewhere.
I also believe that if Catholic Extremists were in place of the Muslim Extremists/terrorists and the Catholics succeeded in murdering thousands of people in one incident, then they should not build a church so close to the site, just out of respect. And technically I am Catholic. What’s right/wrong for one race or religion should be right/wrong for another.
As far as asking if people would have a problem with a Walmart being built there…. If Walmart Extremists did this, then yes I would have a problem with that too. I think the bottom line is that the extremists who did this, no matter how far removed from the general Muslims, still have Muslim roots and are tied in with the Muslim community in such intricate ways. Again, I do not believe that all Muslims are like this or even the majority of them are like this.
If Iman did make comments about America deserving this or bringing on themselves that’s terrible and wrong. I think it’s disgusting and disturbing for ANYONE to make any comment remotely close to that. If there is a problem with the way this country is run, don’t kill the innocent people over it. I would almost rather you go after the government officials instead. I know I might get flamed for saying that... but I will never understand killing any innocent person because of the decisions and actions made by someone in power. Why not just go after that person then?
ETA: I work in Manhattan and live in Queens
Message edited 8/18/2010 10:02:37 AM.
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| Posted 8/18/10 9:43 AM |
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Aga
hello baby Albert
Member since 9/05 7750 total posts
Name:
Aga
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
here is a link to full episode of Daily show with Jon Stewart talking about this topic daily show
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| Posted 8/18/10 9:48 AM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
Posted by faithann
Posted by dm24angel
Its not a home for wayward radical's to plot...Its a place for people to worship God, the same God we all do.
I'm not necessarily against this mosque- but it's not being built to worship "the same God we all do".
I'm a Christian. Muslims believe in worshipping one God- and so do I. But they are not the same God. I'm sure any Muslim would feel the same way.
It is actually the same diety; different prophets. Allah is the Arabic word for God, just like Yehovah is the Hebrew word.
and Abraham's (Old Testament Abraham) first son, Ishmael, is considered the father of the Arab people - essentially those who will convert to Islam.
yes, theology of the three religions differ, but they are all connected.
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| Posted 8/18/10 9:57 AM |
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Erica
LIF Adult
Member since 5/05 11767 total posts
Name:
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
We should be screaming about the vandalism at the Staten Island 911 memorial
but this isn't as interesting to the media I guess.
Message edited 8/18/2010 9:58:55 AM.
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| Posted 8/18/10 9:58 AM |
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BunnyWife
Insert Witty Comment Here
Member since 5/07 8274 total posts
Name:
BunnyWife
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
I would love to know of how many of the people who are against this live or work anywhere near the site or even in the 5 boroughs?
Call me crazy but it really pisses me off when someone like Sarah Palin feels like she has a say in what happens in my city.
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| Posted 8/18/10 10:01 AM |
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MrsKS
Thank You St. Gerard.....
Member since 12/09 8306 total posts
Name:
Kerri
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Re: Having trouble understanding this - Mosque at WTC site
you are absolutely right,
on both accounts!!
This is disgusting!! 
I didn't even know about it. The media tells us what the media wants us to know about...
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| Posted 8/18/10 10:01 AM |
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