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JennZ
MY LIFE!!
Member since 8/05 25463 total posts
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by Ophelia
maybe I am not too learned...but I didn't know anyone believe God put pen to paper to write the bible.
what religion is that?
Not in that way, but there are people who believe that the bible was channeled through the writers and was not influenced by their beliefs and human error.
Most people believe as most people on this thread believe, that there is a great deal of human error involved, and we have to accept that, and it's not worth dismissing the entire Bible over.
can I ask what research or experience gives you the knowlege and certainty to make so many statements with the words "most people believe" "some people believe"???
the idea that you *know* something that others don't is what hurts your case.
the idea that the 2 classes you took on religion with their mixed religion students gives you some kind of platform to speak so broadly hurts your case.
the fact that no one on here is claiming to be a creationist yet you keep *hoping* for one to engage in some kind of dialogue hurts your case.
the fact that you don't see to think before you type or speak hurts your case.
to my eyes, you don't read like someone that has read up on the arguments from both sides of the table and has formed her own conclusion.
you read like someone told you something once, and you ran with it.
this may or may not be the case..but this is what you are presenting. and that definitely does not help your case at all.
Once again, WELL SAID!!!!!
Oh and ITA!!!
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Posted 2/13/08 2:26 PM  |
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Long Island Weddings
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by JenniferEver
Like everyone who answered on this thread and misinterpreted the question, ignoring the word literal?
uh, no. that was addressed already by multiple people.
again, read. digest. then speak.
Everyone who answered said "There are errors in the bible"
the question was directed toward people who don't believe there are errors
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:27 PM |
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05mommy09
Family of 5!
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<3 Mommy <3
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by QuoteTheRaven424
i'm going to say this once
we don't reconcile it - at least i don't
it's called faith - it's not based on logic
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:28 PM |
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Stacey1403
Where it all began....
Member since 5/05 24065 total posts
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:29 PM |
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MrsERod
Praying for Everyone.
Member since 5/05 26170 total posts
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MrsERod™®
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Stacey1403
IMAGE
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:30 PM |
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Lisa
I'm a PANK!!!
Member since 5/05 22334 total posts
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Professional Aunts No Kids
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
 
Message edited 2/13/2008 2:31:56 PM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:31 PM |
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Stacey1403
Where it all began....
Member since 5/05 24065 total posts
Name:
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by MrsERod
Posted by Stacey1403
IMAGE
IMAGE
I just spit soda out
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:31 PM |
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MrsERod
Praying for Everyone.
Member since 5/05 26170 total posts
Name:
MrsERod™®
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Stacey1403
Posted by MrsERod
Posted by Stacey1403
IMAGE
IMAGE
I just spit soda out
then my work here is done 
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:32 PM |
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
I'm just curious why this even matters?
I was always taught to respect everyone's own personal views on God and religion.
as long as its not a God Hates F*gs person or someone spilling hate, then let people believe what they want to believe.
We all need a reason to wake up in the morning, and we all need a reason to go on when things in our lives get tough.
Does it matter where it comes from? Or how we interpret it?
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:35 PM |
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rojerono
Happiest.
Member since 8/06 13803 total posts
Name:
Jeannie
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
St. Augustine once said "God is not what you imagine or what you think you understand. If you understand you have failed.."
I don't need to understand why God chose to put conflicting stories in the bible.
I don't need to understand why evolution seems to be so much more likely than the story of Creation.
I don't need to understand why God put me on this planet.
I don't need to understand if my bible is better than your bible or her Torah.
Because I don't think I have the capacity to understand the motivations or actions of a being as supreme as the God that I believe in. I don't question God. I just do my best to carry out His commands as best I can with my limited mortal vision and understanding.
I also will not tell you that your understanding of God's will is better or worse than mine. Because I don't know that. I just know what my heart and my faith tell ME.
If that makes me stupid or naive or ignorant in anyone's eyes, I am okay with that.
Message edited 2/13/2008 2:36:32 PM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:35 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by rojerono
St. Augustine once said "God is not what you imagine or what you think you understand. If you understand you have failed.."
I don't need to understand why God chose to put conflicting stories in the bible.
I don't need to understand why evolution seems to be so much more likely than the story of Creation.
I don't need to understand why God put me on this planet.
I don't need to understand if my bible is better than your bible or her Torah.
Because I don't think I have the capacity to understand the motivations or actions of a being as supreme as the God that I believe in. I don't question God. I just do my best to carry out His commands as best I can with my limited mortal vision and understanding.
I also will not tell you that your understanding of God's will is better or worse than mine. Because I don't know that. I just know what my heart and my faith tell ME.
If that makes me stupid or naive or ignorant in anyone's eyes, I am okay with that.
Thank you!
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:36 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by lipglossjunky73
I'm just curious why this even matters?
I was always taught to respect everyone's own personal views on God and religion.
as long as its not a God Hates F*gs person or someone spilling hate, then let people believe what they want to believe.
We all need a reason to wake up in the morning, and we all need a reason to go on when things in our lives get tough.
Does it matter where it comes from? Or how we interpret it?
It doesn't.
I don't expect my opinion to mean anything to anyone. But I like challenge opinions and have mine challenged.
90% of the stuff on this board is that that "doesn't matter"
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:37 PM |
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Bxgell2
Perfection
Member since 5/05 16438 total posts
Name:
Beth
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
I don't understand why you're insistent on beating this horse 10 feet into the ground.
This is one arena where it's virtually impossible to have an analytical debate because you're talking about FAITH. FAITH does not usually rely on hard-line facts, it's just that - a total belief that may even be irreverent to what science, or facts show to us.
How can you expect someone to "defend" their belief or faith in religion in a debate, when most people are relying on just that - their faith. You're frustrated by most of the responses that they believe in their religion just because they do, but THIS is the essence of religion!
Some choose faith, others don't - there's not much room for intellectual debate in this kind of arena.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:41 PM |
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Sassyz75
Turning a new page
Member since 5/05 9731 total posts
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Dina
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
having just recently read Genesis half way through Leviticus- I am not sure I get what you are referring to- as conflicting? Are you saying Adam & Eve and then Noah conflict each other?
They are two different points in time though- how are they conflicting?
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:42 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Bxgell2
I don't understand why you're insistent on beating this horse 10 feet into the ground.
This is one arena where it's virtually impossible to have an analytical debate because you're talking about FAITH. FAITH does not usually rely on hard-line facts, it's just that - a total belief that may even be irreverent to what science, or facts show to us.
How can you expect someone to "defend" their belief or faith in religion in a debate, when most people are relying on just that - their faith. You're frustrated by most of the responses that they believe in their religion just because they do, but THIS is the essence of religion!
Some choose faith, others don't - there's not much room for intellectual debate in this kind of arena.
We are discussing this on the other thread. I think it's a fundamental difference in outlook. I always want there to be a logical explanation, it's hard for me to understand when sometimes there isn't, so i press for logic, when maybe there is none.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:42 PM |
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donegal419
St. Gerard, pray for us.
Member since 7/07 7650 total posts
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K
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Kara
Honestly, I don't think the question was aimed that way. I think you just like to keep narrowing and narrowing the focus of your questions in your own attempt to make people who believe differently than you look stupid. Maybe it's not your intent -- but you keep asking people to justify things b/c you just can't possibly understand them. When someone tries to explain it to you (here or elsewhere), you just keep saying "no, not what I meant. I meant it in this very limited circumstance which rarely or never exists."
You don't appear to genuinely want to understand anything. You honestly appear to want to call out people who you think have unreasonable beliefs.
I'm SURE you'll post saying that's not your intention. That doesn't change how it comes off.
Well said, Kara! Jennifer, I can appreciate your desire to learn more about people's opinions, but I have found that any time any one has a different opinion than you, you jump down their throat. I experienced this first hand with you when you posted re: the Catholic Church and what people "diasgree" with. I find that if it's not what you AGREE with, the other person is automatically wonrg or misinformed. I think you need to think about posting such controverisal topixs if you are not ready to have your opinion challenged or to let others have their own opinions.
Message edited 2/13/2008 2:46:26 PM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:43 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Sassyz75
having just recently read Genesis half way through Leviticus- I am not sure I get what you are referring to- as conflicting? Are you saying Adam & Eve and then Noah conflict each other?
They are two different points in time though- how are they conflicting?
Genesis 1:God created Male and Female.
Genesis 2: Creation story repeated. This time God puts Adam into a deep sleep and takes out his rib to create Eve.
The Noah story is separate. there are two intertwined stories that say things differently, but it;s much more complicated to explain.
ETA: I am a firm believer in the documentary hypothesis and these are two of the main examples of it in action in common bible stories.
Quite simply, they were stories interpreted differenty by different writers, which is logical. But if you don't go the DH route, or if you are one of the people who believe that human interp and error are not part of the bible it can pose a problem/
Or you can just say Genesis 1 is less specific. But there are other differences too
Message edited 2/13/2008 2:47:23 PM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:45 PM |
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tourist
Member since 5/05 10425 total posts
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Ophelia
maybe I am not too learned...but I didn't know anyone believe God put pen to paper to write the bible.
what religion is that?
Some Baptists do--well--maybe not pen to paper, but they read it literally & don't take into account the context in which it was written or the misinterpretations that occur in translation.
link
Jenn, I think the reconcilation of the 2 stories of creation is a valid question, but even if someone here did believe the Bible literally, I don't think they would be the proper person to ask about it. Most followers do take many things on faith. A Biblical scholar would be more able to to answer this question appropriately.
You probably don't have one of those on speed dial, but this is a huge academic field, and you could probably find some scholarship on it with some research.
Message edited 2/13/2008 2:50:00 PM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:46 PM |
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mtnmama
Member since 5/06 4794 total posts
Name:
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Message edited 10/7/2009 11:27:39 AM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:47 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by tourist
Posted by Ophelia
maybe I am not too learned...but I didn't know anyone believe God put pen to paper to write the bible.
what religion is that?
Some Baptists do--well--maybe not pen to paper, but they read it literally & don't take into account the context in which it was writtenor the misinterpretations that occur in translation.
link
Jenn, I think the reconcilation of the 2 stories of creation is a valid question, but even if someone here did believe the Bible literally, I don't think they would be the proper person to ask about it. Most followers do take many things on faith. A Biblical scholar would be more able to to answer this question appropriately.
You probbaly don't have one of those on speed dial, but this is a huge academic field, and you could probably find some scholarship on it with some research.
Exactly what I meant!
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:47 PM |
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Blazesyth
*yawn*
Member since 5/05 8129 total posts
Name:
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by JenniferEver
We are discussing this on the other thread. I think it's a fundamental difference in outlook. I always want there to be a logical explanation, it's hard for me to understand when sometimes there isn't, so i press for logic, when maybe there is none.
I always want a logical, technical explanation also. Since I can't get one, that is why I am agnostic. I don't ask others to justify their faith to me, I just understand that some people don't need/want the same explanation that I need in order to believe. That is their right, as it's my right to not just blindly believe.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:49 PM |
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Ang-Rich
Beyond Compare
Member since 5/05 17988 total posts
Name:
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by Bxgell2
I don't understand why you're insistent on beating this horse 10 feet into the ground.
This is one arena where it's virtually impossible to have an analytical debate because you're talking about FAITH. FAITH does not usually rely on hard-line facts, it's just that - a total belief that may even be irreverent to what science, or facts show to us.
How can you expect someone to "defend" their belief or faith in religion in a debate, when most people are relying on just that - their faith. You're frustrated by most of the responses that they believe in their religion just because they do, but THIS is the essence of religion!
Some choose faith, others don't - there's not much room for intellectual debate in this kind of arena.
We are discussing this on the other thread. I think it's a fundamental difference in outlook. I always want there to be a logical explanation, it's hard for me to understand when sometimes there isn't, so i press for logic, when maybe there is none.
Beth is 100% correct.
Honestly these questions you keep bringing up need to be put to rest because they all lead back to no where.
I respect that you are, as you say, curious to understand more, but seeing how sensitive this topic becomes once you start pushing buttons...maybe you should just go talk to your priest about these things to get answers.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:50 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Blazesyth
Posted by JenniferEver
We are discussing this on the other thread. I think it's a fundamental difference in outlook. I always want there to be a logical explanation, it's hard for me to understand when sometimes there isn't, so i press for logic, when maybe there is none.
I always want a logical, technical explanation also. Since I can't get one, that is why I am agnostic. I don't ask others to justify their faith to me, I just understand that some people don't need/want the same explanation that I need in order to believe. That is their right, as it's my right to not just blindly believe.
I'm not controverting anyone's right to believe what they want. I just like to discuss things. Obviously other people don't (or do, consider it's going on hours later, or maybe they just like to post 's and then accuse me of name-calling).
I should have learned my lesson years ago.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:51 PM |
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pinkandblue
Our family is complete, maybe
Member since 9/05 32436 total posts
Name:
Stephanie
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Ang-Rich
but seeing how sensitive this topic becomes once you start pushing buttons...maybe you should just go talk to your priest about these things to get answers.
great idea ang. I also think at this point, we are not going to give you the answers you "desire". I am sure there is another forum to hash all of this out.
Message edited 2/13/2008 2:53:06 PM.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:52 PM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Honest question for literal bible interpreters
Posted by Ang-Rich
Posted by JenniferEver
Posted by Bxgell2
I don't understand why you're insistent on beating this horse 10 feet into the ground.
This is one arena where it's virtually impossible to have an analytical debate because you're talking about FAITH. FAITH does not usually rely on hard-line facts, it's just that - a total belief that may even be irreverent to what science, or facts show to us.
How can you expect someone to "defend" their belief or faith in religion in a debate, when most people are relying on just that - their faith. You're frustrated by most of the responses that they believe in their religion just because they do, but THIS is the essence of religion!
Some choose faith, others don't - there's not much room for intellectual debate in this kind of arena.
We are discussing this on the other thread. I think it's a fundamental difference in outlook. I always want there to be a logical explanation, it's hard for me to understand when sometimes there isn't, so i press for logic, when maybe there is none.
Beth is 100% correct.
Honestly these questions you keep bringing up need to be put to rest because they all lead back to no where.
I respect that you are, as you say, curious to understand more, but seeing how sensitive this topic becomes once you start pushing buttons...maybe you should just go talk to your priest about these things to get answers.
The priest believes what I do..maybe I need to find some evangelicals!
I will stick to mundane topics.
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| Posted 2/13/08 2:52 PM |
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