| Posted By |
Message |
| Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 >> |
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
I'm pro-choice and a gun owner. While I personally do not hunt I know that hunting is done for sport, food & also for nuisance control. Wolves are serious predators that are prolific breeders in some areas. I know people that are chicken owners that have had entire flocks that were in secure chicken pens savagely killed by wolves that broke through.
As someone that practices animal husbandry and someone that is a complete animal, bug, reptile, fish, bird lover, I can tell you I would shoot to kill any predator that threatened my chickens.
IMO is really difficult for people that have always lived in urban & suburban settings to understand the realities of living year round in a place like Alaska.
I'm personally MUCH more offended by the amount of chemical warfare Long Islanders have impossed on our local eco-system & our water supply by using the Scotts program on their lush, un-natural GREEN toxic lawns than by someone hunting wolves.
Its really easy for the pot to call the kettle black in every situation.
I have family that live in Alaska. while they protect their land (totally understandable) they don't get up in a helicopter to shoot wolves for sport.
we should remember, the wildlife was here long before we ever were...WE are encroaching on THEIR land and where they hunt...not the other way around.
they need to eat to. this is something *I* would expect a "Pro life" person to understand and embrace as well.
|
Posted 9/3/08 11:15 AM  |
| |
|
Long Island Weddings
Long Island's Largest Bridal Resource |
DandN
Twins are here!
Member since 3/06 3597 total posts
Name:
Deirdre
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by Tilde
 smart@ss. 
well i guess i should go find THAT facebook group and sign up. . . .
seriously though, the term pro life is and has always been misleading.
I mean, look at the "pro lifers" that kill abortion doctors and blow up clinics.
they are more concerned about being "right" than they are about preserving life.
a "pro life" person should be against the death of anything...and should be for any advancements of LIFE (ie stem cell research)
Jesus wouldn't put ANYONE to death...unborn baby, roaming wolf, or convicted serial killer alike.
THAT is pro life.
anything else is picking and choosing...and pardon the pun...shoots down the validity of the argument. 
That's why I never use the term. I am pro choice and I refer to Sarah Palin as being anti choice.
Everyone is Anti abortion - no one thinks we should have more of them. It's solely a choice issue for me. I doubt I could ever have one - but I couldnt make that decision for anyone else.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:24 AM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
if any of us are going to expect any person with radical political views to not be a hypocrite in some form we would be naive.
As a teenage mother I ironically became the person every pregnant girl in my high school would turn to, even if I didn't know them. I became the official driver & chapperone to "the clinic" for every girl that didn't know who the guy was or the guy was someone they couldn't count on to take them. From 1987 to 1988 I probably personally took 20 girls under 18 for abortions, all while being a person that CHOSE to give birth & raise my child. Believe me when I tell you I threatened to run over "pro-lifers" AKA old men holding nasty posters, I screamed at them, told them to go f@ck themselves. I crossed the line with terrified, ashamed young girls many times.
I COMPLETELY DISAGREE with the "pro-life" stance, but its a radical belief & in my experience anyone that believes that radically in anything is a hypocrite.
However in this country we do have "the right" to think what we want.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:26 AM |
| |
|
MarisaK
HELLO Manolo !!
Member since 5/06 14562 total posts
Name:
Marisa
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
I am 150% pro choice, and I can see how/why someone pro life would hunting a wolf is not the same as aborting a fetus .......(or as a pro lifer sees it, an unborn child)
I don't really see it as comparable either -
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:26 AM |
| |
|
CaMacho
Sisters :)
Member since 7/06 15112 total posts
Name:
Jess
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
I always thought that if you were pro-life, you feel all human beings have the right to life, even the unborn, until natural death.
So hunting and killing animals wouldn't have anything to do with being "pro-life", but capital punishment would.
Then again, maybe that's not the correct definition of pro-life? Can someone who is pro-life say if this is correct... ?
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:27 AM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
if any of us are going to expect any person with radical political views to not be a hypocrite in some form we would be naive.
in my experience anyone that believes that radically in anything is a hypocrite.
However in this country we do have "the right" to think what we want.
I don't think anyone has that expectation or is showing any naivete...pointing it out is not the same as being surprised by it 
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:29 AM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by KellyFG
if any of us are going to expect any person with radical political views to not be a hypocrite in some form we would be naive.
in my experience anyone that believes that radically in anything is a hypocrite.
However in this country we do have "the right" to think what we want.
I don't think anyone has that expectation or is showing any naivete...pointing it out is not the same as being surprised by it
some of the posts seemed to be in a tone of surprise or might I say horror.
I havent met a politician yet that didn't contridict themselves in some way.
Message edited 9/3/2008 11:32:20 AM.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:31 AM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by KellyFG
if any of us are going to expect any person with radical political views to not be a hypocrite in some form we would be naive.
in my experience anyone that believes that radically in anything is a hypocrite.
However in this country we do have "the right" to think what we want.
I don't think anyone has that expectation or is showing any naivete...pointing it out is not the same as being surprised by it
some of the posts seemed to be in a tone of surprise or might I say horror.
I havent met a politician yet that didn't contridict themselves in some way.
I do find it horrific that ANYONE would get into a helicopter and shoot an animal for sport...pro life, pro death...whomever...the ACT of that I find just awful, especially if it's for sport and not for some kind of protection issue (ie. an animal control officer hunting a murderous animal).
but don't mistake MY horror of the ACT for surprise that a politician is doing it...that part doesnt surprise me one bit...in fact, I LOVE when they make their flawed ideology so easily seen.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:34 AM |
| |
|
WhatNow
Say Cheese!
Member since 1/06 8033 total posts
Name:
A (formerly WhatNow?)
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
I don't see any similarity between an unborn child and an animal...
Having an abortion is not quite the same as eating a steak.
Message edited 9/3/2008 11:40:11 AM.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:39 AM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Not to point anyone out but to say Jesus wouldn't kill any living thing is a stretch. Religion has always referenced the sacrifice of animals.
"The Last Supper was also the Passover meal instituted in the Law of Moses to remember Israel's exodus from slavery in Egypt to start their journey to the promise land. At that time God was going to bring the last plague on Egypt. He would send an angel of death who would kill all the firstborn. God told Israel to sacrifice lambs and to paint the blood of the lamb on their door posts. Upon seeing the blood of the lamb, the angel of death would PASS OVER that house. They were also to eat the lamb that night along with unleavened bread. (Bread without yeast)
In a similar manner Jesus Christ was our Passover. "For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us" 1Cor 5:7b. There are many metaphors of Christ in the Old Testament. He was the lamb that Abel sacrificed of which God was pleased. He was the ram which God provided as a substitutionary sacrifice in the place of Isaac when Abraham took him up the mountain. He was the two goats of Yum Kippur (The Day of Atonement) mentioned in Leviticus 16, one sacrificed for the people and the sins placed upon the other which was led outside the city into the wilderness."
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:44 AM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by WhatNow
I don't see any similarity between an unborn child and an animal...
Having an abortion is not quite the same as eating a steak.
what about killing a LIVING thing soley for the sake of killing it?
unless the slogan is "wolf, it's what's for dinner" in Alaska....she is taking a LIFE to see what a good shot she is.
I don't find that the same as eating meat either.
not only that...but hunting is NOT the only aspect of the NRA and the "right to bear arms"
I am not "stuck" on the hunting thing...I am looking at the totality of her affiliation with the NRA and THEIR beliefs, vs the "pro life" aspect of abortion...Oh and then there's the capital punishment thing...
totality of the circumstances.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:44 AM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
Not to point anyone out but to say Jesus wouldn't kill any living thing is a stretch. Religion has always referenced the sacrifice of animals.
"The Last Supper was also the Passover meal instituted in the Law of Moses to remember Israel's exodus from slavery in Egypt to start their journey to the promise land. At that time God was going to bring the last plague on Egypt. He would send an angel of death who would kill all the firstborn. God told Israel to sacrifice lambs and to paint the blood of the lamb on their door posts. Upon seeing the blood of the lamb, the angel of death would PASS OVER that house. They were also to eat the lamb that night along with unleavened bread. (Bread without yeast)
In a similar manner Jesus Christ was our Passover. "For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us" 1Cor 5:7b. There are many metaphors of Christ in the Old Testament. He was the lamb that Abel sacrificed of which God was pleased. He was the ram which God provided as a substitutionary sacrifice in the place of Isaac when Abraham took him up the mountain. He was the two goats of Yum Kippur (The Day of Atonement) mentioned in Leviticus 16, one sacrificed for the people and the sins placed upon the other which was led outside the city into the wilderness."
yes, but JESUS didn't and wouldn't kill anything.
he stopped the capital punishment of a prostitute (the stoning). he allowed himself to be killed so that sins would be forgiven.
you can't really compare the old Testament to the New, as Jesus was sent to erase the sins of the Old.
Jesus celebrated passover b/c he was JEWISH..but we Christians...believers in Christ, do not. we celebrate the ressurection and eternal life.
it's different. it was a different religion.
and I don't care if you point me out...it's clear as day it's my post you are referencing
Message edited 9/3/2008 11:48:22 AM.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:47 AM |
| |
|
DaniJude
You're My Home <3
Member since 11/06 14815 total posts
Name:
Danielle
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by WhatNow
I don't see any similarity between an unborn child and an animal...
Having an abortion is not quite the same as eating a steak.
I agree.
...and this is from a true animal lover who was a vegetarian for four years before having to go back to meat/fish b/c of health reasons.
She is from Alaska - my nephew's mother is from the state of Washington (very rural area). It is a totally different way of life and a part of their culture. It isn't out of the ordinary for them to go out and "kill dinner" a few nights a week. It is a normal thing that they fish in the "crick" as my nephew's mother would say and eat the fish for lunch. They hunt deer for the meat, her and her family own a farm where they raise all sorts of animals... it is a way of life for some people and I would NEVER know this being that I grew up here my whole life but my eyes were opened to it b/c I also have an Uncle that lives in the state of washington so I've seen it firsthand and have heard it from my nephew's mother.
I guess it is kind of like Teddy Roosevelt - HUGE animal "lover" and all about nature and preservation yet he had more heads in a room of Sagamore Hill then a ZOO -- it didn't make much sense to me but different times/cultures do different things.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:47 AM |
| |
|
nrthshgrl
It goes fast. Pay attention.
Member since 7/05 57538 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
I'm not going to equate killing an animal to a potential child.
IMO pro-life means pro the life of everything (animals, prisoners, etc.).
Anti-abortion means they are against abortions. Those are the ones that blow up abortion clinics to stop abortions.
Anti-abortionists can support capitol punishment, pro-lifers do not as it is not PRO-life.
People can label themselves whatever they want but that's my take on it.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:48 AM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Jesus ate meat, fish & eggs.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:49 AM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Bill Clinton one of the most beloved presidents of our lifetime was Gov of Arkansas where CHILDREN get four excused absences a year from school FOR HUNTING.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:51 AM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
Jesus ate meat, fish & eggs.
just in case you missed it, I don't equate eating meat with Hunting for sport.
Posted by Ophelia
what about killing a LIVING thing soley for the sake of killing it?
unless the slogan is "wolf, it's what's for dinner" in Alaska....she is taking a LIFE to see what a good shot she is.
I don't find that the same as eating meat either.
.
and I've already said ad naseum on this thread...the SPORT part of hunting and calling oneself "pro life" is what I find so amusing.
this is really going no where now.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:54 AM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
Bill Clinton one of the most beloved presidents of our lifetime was Gov of Arkansas where CHILDREN get four excused absences a year from school FOR HUNTING.
I don't think he claims to be pro life either...so I have no issue with that.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:54 AM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
calling the parkway the parkway & the driveway the driveway doesn't make any sense either
Pro-life is not really the right term but it is what stuck to the feeling that life begins at conception & should not be terminated. I'm sure if the people on that platform really knew how different people read into it & how hypocritical it makes them seem, they'd consider changing it.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 11:58 AM |
| |
|
WhatNow
Say Cheese!
Member since 1/06 8033 total posts
Name:
A (formerly WhatNow?)
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by WhatNow
I don't see any similarity between an unborn child and an animal...
Having an abortion is not quite the same as eating a steak.
what about killing a LIVING thing soley for the sake of killing it?
unless the slogan is "wolf, it's what's for dinner" in Alaska....she is taking a LIFE to see what a good shot she is.
I don't find that the same as eating meat either.
not only that...but hunting is NOT the only aspect of the NRA and the "right to bear arms"
I am not "stuck" on the hunting thing...I am looking at the totality of her affiliation with the NRA and THEIR beliefs, vs the "pro life" aspect of abortion...Oh and then there's the capital punishment thing...
totality of the circumstances.
Again, life of an animal and life of unborn human being is completely different!
Having said that, I must also add that I personally would never go hunting whether I ate the kill or not, even though I would never put the same value on the life of a human and on the of an animal. I would just never enjoy te whole hunt and kill process...
However, we must remember that this is a completely different culture, where hunting is a normal part of everyday life.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 12:00 PM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by KellyFG
Bill Clinton one of the most beloved presidents of our lifetime was Gov of Arkansas where CHILDREN get four excused absences a year from school FOR HUNTING.
I don't think he claims to be pro life either...so I have no issue with that.
By all means Bill would want any woman he knocked up by accident to have a choice. Its hard to get that much DNA on someone's dress if you're wearing a condom.
Message edited 9/3/2008 12:01:47 PM.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 12:01 PM |
| |
|
Kara
Now Zagat Rated!
Member since 3/07 13217 total posts
Name:
They call me "Tater Salad"
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
Bill Clinton one of the most beloved presidents of our lifetime was Gov of Arkansas where CHILDREN get four excused absences a year from school FOR HUNTING.
Just in case people were wondering, Obama is also apparently a strong supporter of hunters, at least according to his web site and several statements made on behalf of his campaign. He's also for capital punishment.
And yes, I fully get that you are discussing what people feel is a hypocritical viewpoint of being "pro-life" and being pro-hunting... but I think this is still worth mentioning while on the topic.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 12:03 PM |
| |
|
Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by Ophelia
Posted by KellyFG
Bill Clinton one of the most beloved presidents of our lifetime was Gov of Arkansas where CHILDREN get four excused absences a year from school FOR HUNTING.
I don't think he claims to be pro life either...so I have no issue with that.
By all means Bill would want any woman he knocked up by accident to have a choice. Its hard to get that much DNA on someone's dress if you're wearing a condom.
ha...there IS a way to get that much juice on a dress and not be anywhere near the vayjay 
no need for abortions when you can just get hummer!
|
| Posted 9/3/08 12:03 PM |
| |
|
Kara
Now Zagat Rated!
Member since 3/07 13217 total posts
Name:
They call me "Tater Salad"
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
pffft
|
| Posted 9/3/08 12:04 PM |
| |
|
sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
|
Re: ok.. Palin is pro-life...
Posted by Ophelia
ha...there IS a way to get that much juice on a dress and not be anywhere near the vayjay
no need for abortions when you can just get hummer!
That reminds me of that great insult from back in the day
"you're such a jackazz, your mother should have swallowed you"
I'm starting a new policital platform
"pro-hummer"
which BTW would be incrediably hypocritical of me since I HATE oversized SUVs!!!!
Message edited 9/3/2008 12:09:53 PM.
|
| Posted 9/3/08 12:08 PM |
| |
|
| Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 5 >> |
