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Bearcat
Love my little girls!!! <3
Member since 6/10 10818 total posts
Name:
E
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by MrsA1012
Posted by lcherian
The real problem is that our country has the highest rates of chronic illness than anywhere else in the world. We are also the most medicated. Until those issues are resolved, healthcare will never be affordable.
. Thank you so much for writing this. I could not agree more. People eat disgusting food , don't exercise , drink , smoke and generally abuse their bodies. They then become obese, develop type 2 diabetes, heart disease , high blood pressure etc. Instead of making lifestyle changes they take medication and have expensive procedures. The cycle then continues and the costs stay high. Very sad.
Sooooo just to play devil's (devil being the unpopular opinion) advocate here, then doesn't obamacare, on some level, require people who make good, healthy choices pay for the care of people who make poor, unhealthy choices? Shouldn't we, as a society, help one another by encouraging better lifestyle choices as opposed to placing a bandaid on them?
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Posted 1/10/13 10:06 PM  |
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Long Island Weddings
Long Island's Largest Bridal Resource |
MrsA1012
love my little girl !
Member since 9/10 5777 total posts
Name:
Me
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by Bearcat
Posted by MrsA1012
Posted by lcherian
The real problem is that our country has the highest rates of chronic illness than anywhere else in the world. We are also the most medicated. Until those issues are resolved, healthcare will never be affordable.
. Thank you so much for writing this. I could not agree more. People eat disgusting food , don't exercise , drink , smoke and generally abuse their bodies. They then become obese, develop type 2 diabetes, heart disease , high blood pressure etc. Instead of making lifestyle changes they take medication and have expensive procedures. The cycle then continues and the costs stay high. Very sad.
Sooooo just to play devil's (devil being the unpopular opinion) advocate here, then doesn't obamacare, on some level, require people who make good, healthy choices pay for the care of people who make poor, unhealthy choices? Shouldn't we, as a society, help one another by encouraging better lifestyle choices as opposed to placing a bandaid on them?
I agree with much of what you are arguing and it does bother me greatly. I just don't know what the answer is. These are two ideas I do have:
I think much more time/ money should be directed toward teaching people how to make healthy/responsible choices. In addition, I think that there are things in our food supply that should not be there ( GMOS, antibiotics, pesticides, hormones etc). I wish our government would take the same steps that governments in other developed countries have taken to restrict and regulate these danger properties.
These aren't perfect, but they I do believe they would help.
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| Posted 1/10/13 10:27 PM |
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MC09
arrrghhh!!!!
Member since 2/09 5674 total posts
Name:
Me speaks pirate!
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by maymama
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
this is america. a place where people have to work for what they have, not have it handed to them. I do not agree with the above statement at all.
But so many people ARE working and STILL don't have healthcare (either not offered by their employer, or can't afford a private plan)...... How do you explain that? I guess somehow *those* people are beneath those that can afford healthcare, or have it offered by their employer.... or maybe they just don't work as hard as you at their part-time minimum wage job, and so maybe they don't deserve it as much.... I'm just trying to understand your logic here.
In countries that utilize universal healthcare systems, I don't think anyone is "handing" their citizens anything... It's a system everyone pays into and everyone uses equally when needed. *Those* countries recognize healthcare as a basic human right. This is one of the only civilized, western, first world nations that views healthcare as a privilege afforded to few instead of a right afforded to all. I guess I just don't equate healthcare with, say, a brand new car.. or any other material object. I just never understand this argument of someone being "handed" the ability to see a doctor if they are ill.
Message edited 1/10/2013 11:16:45 PM.
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| Posted 1/10/13 11:02 PM |
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KristenRSF
LIF Toddler
Member since 5/10 487 total posts
Name:
Kris
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by Xelindrya
On an entirely different note..
I feel silly for even getting involved in this. WE LOST the fight a LOOOONG time ago (aka when the bill was held up by SC).
What difference does any of this make?
So they will fire people, reduce hours
So others will have insurance (including me) that wasn't there before
So we pay a little extra taxes
SO WHAT?!
Times change. We need to move on.
Frankly I will be honest, we have OTHER issues still at hand. This one is dead. Do I disagree? Yes, I do but thank GOD this is STILL AMERICA where I can say "that was dumb" but still if the People have spoken, its still my country.
Though I would love for this to have been a majority vote issue, it was not. So its done
Done
DONE
Lets get MENTAL HEALTH covered!
ETA: its like arguing who won the presidency. its done.. Move on!
You do realize that a specialist co-pay is much more expensive than a GP co-pay, right? Like, a psychologist or psychiatrist?
Meh.
Message edited 1/11/2013 6:58:41 AM.
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| Posted 1/11/13 6:57 AM |
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Diane
Hope is Contagious....catch it
Member since 5/05 30683 total posts
Name:
D
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
good for him, I know my DH cant afford to.
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| Posted 1/11/13 7:08 AM |
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sunnyplus3
:)
Member since 11/05 8749 total posts
Name:
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
Your father offers it or pays the premium? There is a huge difference.
My father owns a manufacturing company on long island, he has employed hundreds of people since he started in 1972, he has always provided insurance for his full time employees. However due to premium increases and the deterioration of the manufacturing industry in our country he has had to lower the type of insurance he can afford to provide.
In my field, dentistry many practices offer health insurance but employees want it to be free to them so they elect not to participate, still leaving them uninsured. Which lands them in the emergency room when they are ill. It also causes them to miss work casing more suffering to the business. These are mostly young women with leased vehicles, high end designer purses, cell phones and heavy social calendars yet they are the working poor and " cant afford " $300 per month toward their premium.
I have been tracking the increase of health insurance premiums within my field for 10 years and it has averaged
18% per year.
Dental practices ideally run at 65% overhead, someone please tell me what small businesses particularly in the last 4 years have experienced consistent 20% profit increase to cover increased premiums that employees
don't want( feel they should have) to contribute to?
I believe as a society we lack personal accountability. Some say our new healthcare system will improve this, I hope they are right.
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| Posted 1/11/13 7:42 AM |
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tara73
carseat nerd
Member since 11/09 3669 total posts
Name:
Buttercup
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by MC09
Posted by maymama
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
this is america. a place where people have to work for what they have, not have it handed to them. I do not agree with the above statement at all.
But so many people ARE working and STILL don't have healthcare (either not offered by their employer, or can't afford a private plan)...... How do you explain that? I guess somehow *those* people are beneath those that can afford healthcare, or have it offered by their employer.... or maybe they just don't work as hard as you at their part-time minimum wage job, and so maybe they don't deserve it as much.... I'm just trying to understand your logic here.
In countries that utilize universal healthcare systems, I don't think anyone is "handing" their citizens anything... It's a system everyone pays into and everyone uses equally when needed. *Those* countries recognize healthcare as a basic human right. This is one of the only civilized, western, first world nations that views healthcare as a privilege afforded to few instead of a right afforded to all. I guess I just don't equate healthcare with, say, a brand new car.. or any other material object. I just never understand this argument of someone being "handed" the ability to see a doctor if they are ill.
When I've asked this question in the past, the answer has been that the people should have "worked harder, gone to school, done better" etc. or that if they're that poor they probably just get Medicaid anyways. Both are which are untrue.
I will never understand why people think that the people that work these "low level" jobs are somehow beneath them and undeserving of the same benefits they receive.
If the argument is that we shouldn't as society support the people who don't work then why don't ALL working people deserve to have access to proper and affordable healthcare?
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| Posted 1/11/13 8:53 AM |
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DiamondGirl
You are my I love you
Member since 7/09 18802 total posts
Name:
DiamondMama
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
Your father offers it or pays the premium? There is a huge difference.
My father owns a manufacturing company on long island, he has employed hundreds of people since he started in 1972, he has always provided insurance for his full time employees. However due to premium increases and the deterioration of the manufacturing industry in our country he has had to lower the type of insurance he can afford to provide.
In my field, dentistry many practices offer health insurance but employees want it to be free to them so they elect not to participate, still leaving them uninsured. Which lands them in the emergency room when they are ill. It also causes them to miss work casing more suffering to the business. These are mostly young women with leased vehicles, high end designer purses, cell phones and heavy social calendars yet they are the working poor and " cant afford " $300 per month toward their premium.
I have been tracking the increase of health insurance premiums within my field for 10 years and it has averaged
18% per year.
Dental practices ideally run at 65% overhead, someone please tell me what small businesses particularly in the last 4 years have experienced consistent 20% profit increase to cover increased premiums that employees
don't want( feel they should have) to contribute to?
I believe as a society we lack personal accountability. Some say our new healthcare system will improve this, I hope they are right.
My father pays the premium, he pays roughly $60,000 a year to insure his employees (it is a small law practice so the $60,000 isnt covering that many people).
It is very expensive. Does my father do well? yes he does but not so well that he does not feel the $60k, it is a sacrafice for him but it is one that he makes for his staff. I know many people who do much better and don't pay their employees insurance.
It is wrong IMO part of your overhead is insurance if you own a small busines..
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| Posted 1/11/13 9:48 AM |
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Ophelia
she's baaccckkkk ;)
Member since 5/06 23378 total posts
Name:
remember, when Gulliver traveled....
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
one of my favorite parts of the Health Care REform bill is the responsibility it shifts to the individual. you either pay your part to get insured OR you pay a fine. accountability.
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| Posted 1/11/13 9:54 AM |
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by DiamondGirl
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
Your father offers it or pays the premium? There is a huge difference.
My father owns a manufacturing company on long island, he has employed hundreds of people since he started in 1972, he has always provided insurance for his full time employees. However due to premium increases and the deterioration of the manufacturing industry in our country he has had to lower the type of insurance he can afford to provide.
In my field, dentistry many practices offer health insurance but employees want it to be free to them so they elect not to participate, still leaving them uninsured. Which lands them in the emergency room when they are ill. It also causes them to miss work casing more suffering to the business. These are mostly young women with leased vehicles, high end designer purses, cell phones and heavy social calendars yet they are the working poor and " cant afford " $300 per month toward their premium.
I have been tracking the increase of health insurance premiums within my field for 10 years and it has averaged
18% per year.
Dental practices ideally run at 65% overhead, someone please tell me what small businesses particularly in the last 4 years have experienced consistent 20% profit increase to cover increased premiums that employees
don't want( feel they should have) to contribute to?
I believe as a society we lack personal accountability. Some say our new healthcare system will improve this, I hope they are right.
My father pays the premium, he pays roughly $60,000 a year to insure his employees (it is a small law practice so the $60,000 isnt covering that many people).
It is very expensive. Does my father do well? yes he does but not so well that he does not feel the $60k, it is a sacrafice for him but it is one that he makes for his staff. I know many people who do much better and don't pay their employees insurance.
It is wrong IMO part of your overhead is insurance if you own a small busines..
I think I see now why you have such good character from what you post. It appears to be in your bloodline.
That is awesome of your father. I wish more were like him!.
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| Posted 1/11/13 9:55 AM |
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JenniferEver
The Disney Lady
Member since 5/05 18163 total posts
Name:
Jennifer
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by DiamondGirl
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
Your father offers it or pays the premium? There is a huge difference.
My father owns a manufacturing company on long island, he has employed hundreds of people since he started in 1972, he has always provided insurance for his full time employees. However due to premium increases and the deterioration of the manufacturing industry in our country he has had to lower the type of insurance he can afford to provide.
In my field, dentistry many practices offer health insurance but employees want it to be free to them so they elect not to participate, still leaving them uninsured. Which lands them in the emergency room when they are ill. It also causes them to miss work casing more suffering to the business. These are mostly young women with leased vehicles, high end designer purses, cell phones and heavy social calendars yet they are the working poor and " cant afford " $300 per month toward their premium.
I have been tracking the increase of health insurance premiums within my field for 10 years and it has averaged
18% per year.
Dental practices ideally run at 65% overhead, someone please tell me what small businesses particularly in the last 4 years have experienced consistent 20% profit increase to cover increased premiums that employees
don't want( feel they should have) to contribute to?
I believe as a society we lack personal accountability. Some say our new healthcare system will improve this, I hope they are right.
My father pays the premium, he pays roughly $60,000 a year to insure his employees (it is a small law practice so the $60,000 isnt covering that many people).
It is very expensive. Does my father do well? yes he does but not so well that he does not feel the $60k, it is a sacrafice for him but it is one that he makes for his staff. I know many people who do much better and don't pay their employees insurance.
It is wrong IMO part of your overhead is insurance if you own a small busines..
I totally agree. My uncle owns a business and is the same way. His employees also had a GREAT plan. He just considered it a necessary expense like any other business expense
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| Posted 1/11/13 9:56 AM |
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blue11
LIF Adult
Member since 2/11 1706 total posts
Name:
kat
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
here is a link that explains who the uninsured are - for the most part they are working people in the low to moderate income level.
for a quick brief
for more info start on page 5
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| Posted 1/11/13 9:58 AM |
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MC09
arrrghhh!!!!
Member since 2/09 5674 total posts
Name:
Me speaks pirate!
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by DiamondGirl
It is wrong IMO part of your overhead is insurance if you own a small busines..
 Thank you!
It is to be factored into your overhead as any other expense would be.
As a small business owner, would you not purchase liability insurance or commercial property insurance and factor it into the cost of running your business?
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| Posted 1/11/13 11:30 AM |
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MC09
arrrghhh!!!!
Member since 2/09 5674 total posts
Name:
Me speaks pirate!
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by maymama
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by maymama
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
this is america. a place where people have to work for what they have, not have it handed to them. I do not agree with the above statement at all.
we are all guaranteed the pursuit of happiness, not happiness. it is not the government's job to make us wealthy or poor or to DEMAND we have anything - healthcare included.
since the inception of the country, people have struggled. that is what makes the country what it is. and yet, people still want to be here, people WANT to be Americans. They come here with the money in their pockets and clothes on their backs and hope for the best. This country will fail (oh wait, it is) without that very basic foundation.
Yes, we're also all guaranteed LIFE. Healthcare falls into that category, not the category of happiness.
i don't agree with that. healthcare and life are not synonymous. people have survived for hundreds of generations without their healthcare provided. its a fact of life. nothing in life is fair. the only way for everyone to have healthcare is for you and I to pay for it.
Wait, what? Is this even a serious statement?
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| Posted 1/11/13 11:36 AM |
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ElizaRags35
My 2 Girls
Member since 2/09 20494 total posts
Name:
Me
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by DiamondGirl
Posted by KellyFG
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
Your father offers it or pays the premium? There is a huge difference.
My father owns a manufacturing company on long island, he has employed hundreds of people since he started in 1972, he has always provided insurance for his full time employees. However due to premium increases and the deterioration of the manufacturing industry in our country he has had to lower the type of insurance he can afford to provide.
In my field, dentistry many practices offer health insurance but employees want it to be free to them so they elect not to participate, still leaving them uninsured. Which lands them in the emergency room when they are ill. It also causes them to miss work casing more suffering to the business. These are mostly young women with leased vehicles, high end designer purses, cell phones and heavy social calendars yet they are the working poor and " cant afford " $300 per month toward their premium.
I have been tracking the increase of health insurance premiums within my field for 10 years and it has averaged
18% per year.
Dental practices ideally run at 65% overhead, someone please tell me what small businesses particularly in the last 4 years have experienced consistent 20% profit increase to cover increased premiums that employees
don't want( feel they should have) to contribute to?
I believe as a society we lack personal accountability. Some say our new healthcare system will improve this, I hope they are right.
My father pays the premium, he pays roughly $60,000 a year to insure his employees (it is a small law practice so the $60,000 isnt covering that many people).
It is very expensive. Does my father do well? yes he does but not so well that he does not feel the $60k, it is a sacrafice for him but it is one that he makes for his staff. I know many people who do much better and don't pay their employees insurance.
It is wrong IMO part of your overhead is insurance if you own a small busines..
Do we have the same father? 
My dad is the founding partner of a small firm of about 10-15 people. Up until last year, the firm paid 100% health insurance for every single person + families if they had. For me with DH, it cost $19,000 for the year. So when business wasn't doing as well last year, they had to make some changes. Now employees have to contribute no more than half. Still, each and everyone with their families is still covered. If it's a rough month, my dad and the other senior partner will not take a paycheck to insure that everyone gets paid and that they don't have to layoff any employees. When things got really rough, they had to layoff one person, regretfully. After a couple of months, the hired her back part time and still made sure she was covered under unemployment. When she stopped being eligible for unemployment, she came back full time. Almost all of the employees have been there for at least 10 years out of loyalty. I'm the most recent hire and I've been here for 18 months.
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| Posted 1/11/13 11:37 AM |
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MandJZ
Time for Baby #2!
Member since 8/10 4194 total posts
Name:
M
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by MC09
Posted by maymama
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by maymama
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
this is america. a place where people have to work for what they have, not have it handed to them. I do not agree with the above statement at all.
we are all guaranteed the pursuit of happiness, not happiness. it is not the government's job to make us wealthy or poor or to DEMAND we have anything - healthcare included.
since the inception of the country, people have struggled. that is what makes the country what it is. and yet, people still want to be here, people WANT to be Americans. They come here with the money in their pockets and clothes on their backs and hope for the best. This country will fail (oh wait, it is) without that very basic foundation.
Yes, we're also all guaranteed LIFE. Healthcare falls into that category, not the category of happiness.
i don't agree with that. healthcare and life are not synonymous. people have survived for hundreds of generations without their healthcare provided. its a fact of life. nothing in life is fair. the only way for everyone to have healthcare is for you and I to pay for it.
Wait, what? Is this even a serious statement?
Thank you for this.
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| Posted 1/11/13 12:33 PM |
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BunnyWife
Insert Witty Comment Here
Member since 5/07 8274 total posts
Name:
BunnyWife
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Re: Obamacare YIKES!!!
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by MC09
Posted by maymama
Posted by MandJZ
Posted by maymama
Posted by DiamondGirl
So someone give me a better solution.
This is AMERICA every citizen should have health care.
Believe me most companies can afford it. It is an expense that will just need to be factored in.
My father is a small business owner and has always provided his employees with health care. It is the decent thing to do.
this is america. a place where people have to work for what they have, not have it handed to them. I do not agree with the above statement at all.
we are all guaranteed the pursuit of happiness, not happiness. it is not the government's job to make us wealthy or poor or to DEMAND we have anything - healthcare included.
since the inception of the country, people have struggled. that is what makes the country what it is. and yet, people still want to be here, people WANT to be Americans. They come here with the money in their pockets and clothes on their backs and hope for the best. This country will fail (oh wait, it is) without that very basic foundation.
Yes, we're also all guaranteed LIFE. Healthcare falls into that category, not the category of happiness.
i don't agree with that. healthcare and life are not synonymous. people have survived for hundreds of generations without their healthcare provided. its a fact of life. nothing in life is fair. the only way for everyone to have healthcare is for you and I to pay for it.
Wait, what? Is this even a serious statement?
Thank you for this.
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| Posted 1/11/13 1:02 PM |
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